With APS-C sensors, there maybe the possibility of shooting 3:2 video. (1280x1920)
This would seem a happy half way house since it would be a firmware fix rather than a specially made 4:3 sensor and more likely to happen short term.
My math says shooting 3:2 with 2xFHA and resizing back to 2.35:1 only crops out 26% of the horizontal.
@thadon_calico I like how you take it for granted that people asking for 1.5x are hobbyists. Also: I like how you created a profile here just to make that comment.
@johnbrawley Have you asked BMD if they would consider a 4:3 shooting mode (or even 5:4)? That would open a lot of creative doors for anamorphic, and i guess it would enhance the sales of their cam even further. If you see the prices paid for simple 2x anamorphic attachments on eBay, then there must be quite a big community waiting to put those to good use. The BMCC's sensor is indeed perfectly suited for this and BMD would sell the only cam under 3000$ that does proper 4:3.
Can someone clue me into the logic that panasonic, sony, canon et al are going to go back to offering 4:3 because slr magic, (sorry @slrmagic - no offense intended) a small player in the world of optics, is offering a somewhat popular lens? I don't see it happening.
Just FYI - The Red one and Epic have a mode called 4K ANA and 5K ANA that record in the correct aspect ratio for use with 2X anamorphic lenses.
Look into it, it gives you more vertical pixel recording and since you are oversampling at 4 or 5k you can squeeze the image vertically rather than stretch it horizontally and receive the benefits of optical enhancement without losing digital resolution.
yes that's where the extra unused pixels vertically on the BMCC would come in handy.
@thadon_calico do not worry about how many lenses are in the anamorphic design. if the lenses are optical cristal glass this does not matters. think about how many glass are in a video/cinema/photo lens and they are great image quality. what matters is the design, a great design use many lenses is better than a bad design using less lenses or vice-versa.
@Implicit good to see you like and follow my efforts. please, wait some time for me to try and test the lenses design. i did some tests with old and scratched garbage glasses from some years ago when i was working with 35mm adapters, these tests was done to help me design the new lenses. i will show some footage when i get the new designed lenses ready to do tests.
@mlysbakken there's no logic for 1.5x and cropping in post.....also i had to create a profile after coming across this website from frank G's BMCC blog, where he hinted theres an slr magic anamorphic in the works. I googled it and viola! the good thing is SLR magic taking inputs from the community. Its been a dream to own anamorphic for a while, but most used glass do not often resolve 4k images that i work with and they suffer from everything associated with a used lens. I've looked at adapters and dread having to suffer the resolution and light-stop loss they have, I will not gamble on a professional shoot. So i had to login and put my input as I was reading the comments and seeing 1.5 adapter requests inplace of a solid lens
A 1.3x crop LENS is the best option. Just make it resolve high resolution imagery and you've got a winner! From what I read online, Schneider and Sigma are planning theirs as well
@apefos I wasn't referring to the amount of glass in the lens design but addressing those requesting some sort of adapter like the LA7200. that just means more glass slashing resolution. A buddy of mine did some chart tests with a few of these adapters that the 1st AC on a shoot had and the results were too scary to use on a shoot.
I am in a lan house downtown. what a warm emotion and pleasant smile to meet that old partners. but in fact i feel they showed some sadness because i was away for a long time.
well, the glasses are in the lab. it will take some days to do the grinding. i did 10 diferent designs and will try them in the camcorder and in the GH2. maybe one of these designs will work. if not i will do new designs.
plastic and aluminium also in the way to become the body. I have some important considerations about the body. i will try two versions, black plastic and black aluminium. but i think the manufacturer needs to trust in its own intuition. i found plastic is better due to i can design the thread a little more tight and this way the user can align the anamorphic adapter in the correct direction to get horizontal squeeze and it will not rotate if the lens have a no rotating thread. also the plastic thread will not hurt the plastic lenses. also the plastic body will be 20 usd cheaper. good reasons to be plastic. and also it will be lightweight, important to use in plastic lenses.
i have a question for you all.
i belive the 1.33x squeeze will work great with the small camcorders. but for DSLR if i do a reduction in the squeeze factor it will be more easy to get the focus. so if i do a 1.25x squeeze factor i will get 2400x1080 resolution from the 1920x1080 sensor after desqueezing, 2.22:1 aspect ratio. and if i want 2.4:1 aspect ratio from it i just need to crop a little and use 2400x1000 pixels from the desqueezed image, using the 1920x1000 pixels from GH2 sensor. please forget the oval bokeh and horizontal flare just for a while and think about resolution. do you think this 1.25x will be average good?
@thadon_calico I agree with you in wanting a solid lens instead of an adapter, and I understand that a 1.33x would benefit you the most. However, I think you should respect the fact that a lot of people here have other needs and priorities than you. 1.5x is not right for you, but that does not mean it is universally wrong. And even though you don't like the stretched bokeh or the flares, please understand that a lot of us do. I don't care how "professional" you are, your aestethic preferences are not worth more than anyone else's here.
So i had to login and put my input
Thanks!
From what I read online, Schneider and Sigma are planning theirs as well
Maybe we should wait and see whats to come.
@thadon_calico ok, no problem, i understand your thoughts. i just adviced that the image quality can be great with less or more lenses in the way. there are good quality glasses to allow it. if La7200 image is not so good like you want, the LA7200 is a standard definition era adapter and maybe the design and glass was for standard definition and now the full hd needs better glass and better design because full hd show more detail and imperfections shows up. also the optical design is very important and the combination between the adapter and the lens sometimes is good sometimes do not work great.
@slrmagic Please do not wait if you could. I trust in your abilities to make solid lens, I have the 12mm and absolutely love that lens, so I know u guys will make an amazing quality anamorphic
If you are deciding to make a good anamorphic lens, do not use the ag-la7200 as your IQ guide. I strongly suggest getting the iscorama. The image quality is much better and alot sharper. I vote for 1.5X. The 1.33x only gives good streaks but the boked isn't as oval as I wanted it. The 2X ratio is to extreme. I have no doubt that the 4:3 mode will be out soon. As alot of camera company are trying to differentiate themself from others. Even if we have 4:3 mode, the stretch would cause a great lost in IQ. I think the ratio of the iscorama being 1.5X is just right. If I can get my hand on a similiar but modern design, for $1000-1500 I'm all in. It will be a tough job for SLR magic thou. As IQ has to match to those that are currently available. I think the anamorphic market is a huge one. It just that the price is what discouraging peoples from getting a good one. Those kowa 8z and similiar adapters in my opion are unuseable. What is the point of manual focusing two lens, isn't one enought already? That leave us with Lomo and iscorama. Lomo to heavy, 2X ratio to stretchy, can't be use with other lens without losing rack focus. Iscorama to expensive, but is the only one available for low end user. I think that is why the price and demand is high.
@apefos @mlysbakken I'm not a hard -headed guy, if slr magic decides to go with an adapter, I still would buy it regardless of 1.3 or 1.5, I feel that being a modern manufactured glass, they would ensure the highest quality regardless
Also, I suggest since your main purpose is to keeping cost low and IQ quality up, you can just make one similiar to the front part of the Iscorama. The iscorama front can be use with canon, nikon and others 50mm rear lenses without losing rack focuse ability. That way you will save cost by not making the rear lens and it will also appeal to peoples that already own their favorit rear lens brand. My only suggestion is make one that work with 20-35mm focal length. If you can do that for $500-700 each, you will fucking dominate the anamorphic market.
The most wanted anamorphic lens in my eyes would consist of these aspects:
1) 2x anamorphic "desqueezed" into 1.3x output. This would be AMAZING! Otherwise, 1.5x!
2) Make it into a Adapter. Suitable for 50mm and longer (ff equivalent). 35mm would be incredible. This is 25mm & 17.5mm in m43 terms.
3) Aperture at atleast f/2.8.
4) No double focus mechanism.
5) Prices would be 3000$ for adapter choice, 1000-2000$ for fixed lens.
In my honest opinion SLRmagic should compete against the Iscorama series that are available, adapter wise. Iscorama 36 is in my mind the current KING of affordable anamorphic adapters. It has low weight, ultra sharp & 1.5x squeeze for visible anamorphic characthers in the image.
The ONLY issue I see with a fixed lens, is that you lose the ability to choose between wide, medium & tele. Which I feel is VERY important. If SLRmagic decides on fixed lens, please plan on offering atleast a medium lens aswell. IMHO many of the anamorphic pronounced behaviours are not visible in a wide lens.
Lomo also offers anamorphic lenses that are highly sought after. They have them in 35,50,80mm. Being very old, the main downside with these are that they are incredible soft, however due to their anamorphic behaviour they are very popular. A set in good condition can be sold for about 20 000 $! That's more than 6000$ each for a fixed lens!
If you manage to produce a good anamorphic product that becomes a valid option in comparasion to the Iscoramas I am buying it ASAP!
I dont think it is possible to manufacture a copy of the Iscorama 36,42 or 54 since they have a patent which allows the film maker to focus through the anamorphic adapter while the taking lens is set to infinite.
Correct me if I am wrong but isnt the optical design patent a reason why it is so hard for other manufactures to produce a anamorphic adapter that can beat the Iscoramas in IQ, lightloss & ease to focus?
@slrmagic Maybe you should do a poll about prime vs adapter as well? I would buy it either way, but it would be nice to see what option is most sought after :) Then you should probably define the limits of an adapter at the same time. How wide do you think it would be able to go?
Regarding your previous question - if a 2x desqueezed to 1.33x would be interesting: In my eyes it would be the best of both worlds!
@Kautto I think you're right, but that patent is for a focusing mechanism where you set the prime to infinity and focus the adapter. Slrmagic's adapter could still have a focus-through system, like the LA7200's. Don't know if that's harder to make or hurts the IQ, though.
Patent is only for a specific new designs. Front focusing like iscorama is commonly known and giving the time, I don't think those patent are still valid. Alot of patents are only protected for certain amount of years. Beside is fucking china, do you really think they care about patent?
@Kautto - "No double focus mechanism."
My experience with focus-through anamorphic adapters is that without a diopter in front, they're really only in focus at infinity. As you pull in for a close-up, the anamorphic astigmatism gets steadily worse, up until the point where you can't tolerate it anymore. While you can bring the anamorphic closer to focus with a diopter, it's not really precise so you have to fuss with it.
The focus ring on a well-designed anamorphic doesn't work the same as the focus on your main lens. Your main lens needs to be focused close to the anamorphic's sweet spot at the distance you're working. Then you use the anamorphic's focus ring to minimize its astigmatism in both horizontal and vertical axes. You can tell how good the anamorphic glass is by how small the circle of confusion can get. The GH2's magnified focus assist is invaluable for this purpose, and is the main reason I would not try to shoot anamorphic on the AF100.
@ gh2hacked
Beside is fucking china, do you really think they care about patent?
Yes in China we do
I don't think those patent are still valid. Alot of patents are only protected for certain amount of years.
Why copy an old design when we can come up with a new one? We are now working on the possibility of maintaining 1.5X-2X Anamorphic effects on a 1.33X design. It is only with 1.33X you maximise the use of the 16:9. 1.35X would be ideal but unfortunately it is NOT a mode that is available on HDMI LCD screens yet. Just 1.33X, 1.5X, and 2X. If we can offer 1.33X for 16:9 mode that is already available we do not have to wait for a 4:3 mode to be offered. Even if 4:3 mode is offered in the future we highly doubt 16:9 option will be replaced. Anamorphics was used to widen the angle of view while maintaining a tight crop of longer FL lenses and at the same time lot cropping out all the resolution. The are plenty of 2X in circulation already for cheap for 4:3 mode. We can see everyone wants 1.5X or 2X for reasons of Anamorphic look so we will see if we can work in that direction.
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