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Official Sony NEX FS700 and FS700r, 4K cameras topic
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  • You can always get the camera and use it in full HD for everyday stuff, and just rent the 4K add ons for the occasions when you need them.

  • Hi all, just one opinion if the F3 is $16,800.00, with all the extras of a professional camera, i doubt that this small model will pass the 10,000 price range. (really hard) even considering a professional external recorder who needs more than a Black magic ($345) FULL HD 10bits 4:2:2 uncompressed or .mov (really) well the sd card are expensive but when filming professionally to use these formats, you have the budget for SSD's. If really need 4k, well get a large SDI cable to you workstation with a rocketraid tower and this http://www.blackmagic-design.com/products/decklink4k/ and you have serious stuff.

  • @jfro > genlock has almost nothing to do with audio-video or multicam sync and therefore with pluraleyes.

    Wasn't the deal breaker rather "no TC in / out" ?

  • I think this 28Mbit thing is caused by not camera makers restrictions, but instead playback devices restrictions. As many of them have hard time playing even just p60 footage, and with higher bitrates it can be no go.

  • Yea, the 28mb/s is really a bummer. But damn, those frame-rates would be so nice! I'm already excited about a few project I could shoot already!!!

    Now watch as all the C300, and other current pro camera owners, start calling super slow-motion cliche and saying the FS700 is just for "Michael Bay wannabes" and not professionals... ;)

  • Lots of talk on this camera today. This might be the camera that gets me to splurge on an (in my eyes) expensive camera which I qualify as anything over $3500 if it's in the $8k range with a lens. I've seen higher numbers today so I'm assuming these are speculation or testing numbers being thrown around.

    Only negative that I heard voiced today that was a deal breaker for someone was "no genlock" ... With plural eyes in my world, that's not a deal breaker.

    What has thrown a caution flag up (something to check out in coming months) is a statement in Dan Lennie's http://www.denlennie.com/2012/04/sony-nex-fs700-on-location.html preliminary write up today about his experience using a pre production camera:
    1. The camera feels very familiar to the FS100 but with the added benefit of ND filters and an HD-SDI. It's designed to sit between the F3 and FS100. 2. Specs for Internal recording is using AVC HD at 24/28mb/s .

    Calling it a beefed up FS100 with HD-SDI out, ND filters, AND the high speed burst mode recording in 1080--- seems it's going to compete and beat down some of the 13-15k cameras.

    So, my questions would be, when using internal recording, is the 24/28mb/s going to cut it for some of our corporate work (spoiled from Driftwood and other settings)? Some times I like to shoot light without out a lot of extras hanging on the camera.

    Assuming one has lens, LCD screen, mics, SDHC cards, etc, anything else needed outside of a 2k or 4k recorder and lens adapter? What else am I missing (I've never shot with a FS100 or FS3).

  • @bwhitz: Thats good. :) If i could get a 4K cam, i will definitely need a new desktop machine. C4D is great. I really love Modo. Have you checked that out?

    Canon is really in a funky situation. The d800 is a better stills cam and ideal for Landscape/Studio work. Filmwise, there are more alternatives out there. Right now, 04.02, I think the FS700, GH3, and d800(for stills/timelapse) and keep the MkII (stills/timelapse) is the way to go. And we can't forget Sony will release full-frame dSLRs.

  • @thepalalias Me too. :) Although it is about time for a new graphics card... my current one has been spazzing out a bit every so often.

  • @bwhitz I would be worried if the footage required you to upgrade from that. :)

  • @pvjames "You should also plan upgrading your computer for the increased file sizes."

    Oh it need not be upgraded... I can already run Cinema4d, After Effects, and edit 4k prores files all at once. :)

  • My dad just bought an FS100 (and he wouldn't have been able to get this anyway) and after using it, I was blown away. Picture and DR is great and this one is a beefed up version? To me, it just beats the C300 on just about every point, especially since the E-mount is great for adapting lenses too (and with the upgraded Metabones adapter, one could have full control of EF lenses and PL lenses). Plus their support for external recorders is great, after using a Ninja on the GH2, I feel it's the way to go anyway.

  • Strange discussion on Canon products. Their stills cameras are primarily intended as such. Not much to fuzz about.. mkIII without aa-filter looks pretty similar to the gh2. For video, the dslr releases over the last few months (from all manufacturers) have been pretty dissapointing. However, bigger steps are inevitable and the FS700 will no doubt help to push the market forward.

    Re: advertising 4k-ready and the absence of a recorder.. I don't see why this is a problem, quite the contrary - I welcome manufacturers to think ahead (as far as it is possible) so that there is expandability in a product. If you spend 10k, 20k, 30k - really there is no room for a product that has no possibility to evolve in any way - at least from my POV, regarding the camera as a tool which is supposed to pay for itself during it's lifetime. If there are possibilities for things to evolve, you can be sure they will given there is any interest/action around them. The gh2 is a prime example, and that was a development which Panasonic had not envisaged.. So what is wrong then, when manufacturers plan for development?

    With that said, I'm not saying the "upgradeability" of the fs700 will make it successful by itself.

    Red is a front-runner in this sense (upgradeability), although I personally have issues with them.

  • @thepalalias

    yes PhaseOne is exellent, we still have a P60 for still life and technical shots.

  • @peaceonearth Fair enough: our workloads are almost opposite, so I can understand. :) But if it is mainly studio work, do ever venture into Phase One or Hasselblad territory? I keep thinking of renting an IQ180 for a landscape shoot but I would think they would be even more attractive for a studio photographer.

  • @pvjames I think this will be a 15-20K cam with 4K.

    What will they do with C300? Lower the price? I am curious about that but I have no big hope that it will be a product that will prevent me from buying a Sony. Very sorry because I'd like to use all my EF lenses.

    Allready now I was short before buying a FS100 but now we will wait off course until we had a first look at FS700. FS100 with Ninja is superb and internal recording is hard to believe that it's only 4-2-0

  • @thepalalias

    no I am not exited about 1D X. We are working for advertising in studio and on location and mostly we never shoot less than 200 ISO, rarely 400 ISO. If the light is low we use lights. If it's too dark we charge another shooting day ;-) High ISO is no issue for us. It's probably appropriate to GH2 hack and low light. Indie film makers and documentary shooters maybe very interested but advertising or narrative shooters are probably more interessted in detail quality sharpness grading etc.. 1D X means to explain your customers why you shoot now with less pixels than before and half pixel size than competitors with Nikon. If I had the 36MP brand new Nikon I would use it immediately for marketing action. Maybe it's like shooting on film in 8x10" or 4x5". There was no reason why you really needed 8x10" but there where many good reasons to shoot with 8x10". Sorry Vitaly for wandering from the topic.

  • @bwhitz: no prob. Its fun to talk about. I ignored and didn't believe the rumors. So today is like day one for me. :) Completely feel the same way with the Canon specs. You should also plan upgrading your computer for the increased file sizes.

    @peaceonearth: They already had a short window despite being such an incredibly sexy camera. It is the most natural feeling camera on the one hand but i have equal amount of distaste for the price/bang4buck factor. A cam of extremes. Maybe they'll release a C400 on the 15th. I think this will be a 15-20K cam with 4K.

    @danyyyel: i think i read somewhere about 3rd party devices being compatible but don't quote me on that. Maybe from one of the testers. This is the most important issue right now.

  • @danyell I agree about the information, though I cannot fault a company for trying to market a future upgrade path at all. Consumers just have to be smarter.

    @peaceonearth You are not excited about the 1D X? Have you seen how much they improved the lowlight/high ISO performance? It blows the 1DMkIII away. I am very excited about the stills side, though very much waiting and seeing on the video one. The D4 and 1D X deliver so many things that I wanted as far back as 2010 and the 1D X would not require switching glass (for either one of us) so I think there is a lot to be said for them, especially on the stills side. What are you missing from them on the stills side?

  • Not to be a downer here but people should stop saying that it is a 4k camera for sub 10k. In fact this camera could cost the same than a Scarlet working package. The Gemini 444 cost $ 6000 so what will a 4k raw recorder cost!!! I don't like too much the marketing strategy behind it. Say that it will be a 4k camera but not tell you how much the recorder will cost. So I think referring it as a 4k camera for 8k because it is misleading. If the price is $ 8/10 k what you are getting above an fS100 for now is the ND filter and better slow motion. I am not saying it is bad for what it is but it not a 4k camera below $ 10 000 until we know the price of the recorder.

  • @thepalalias @pvjames

    what could that be regarding Canons other products? Remember the big ballyhoo in the run-up to the Paramount presentation? I am still disapointed about the result. Not that the C300 is a bad camera but way far too expensive. At what price point could they launch a "next thing" if they want to keep the C300 in the market?

    And it's not only their video product line, same in still photo products too. We are also in stills photo business with 1DsM3, 5DM2 and 8 L lenses from 17mmTSE to 100-400. Believe me we are a little scared whether this investment is future-proof. No plans for a 5Dm3, least of all for a 1D X

  • @pvjames "I just can't see them coming near this incredible FS700 for features and price-point."

    Yep, all my saved funds are going to the FS700 now. The only thing that could get me to spend it on canon would be this:

    EOS-C 4k DSLR

    -4k mjpeg 4:4:4 recording up to 30fps

    -2k mjpeg, up to 120fps

    -at least 4:2:2 sampled 10-bit uncompressed output

    -$5000 price tag

  • Sounds like a great new camera. Would love to rent one.

  • @bubba @peaceonearth Did you guys forget about the NAB announcement they are planning a couple weeks? The one with the mysterious flyers that the press are getting and speculating will offer 4K?

    I am not saying it will be similar product, but I am also not saying it will not be. Waiting a couple weeks makes sense.

    Not to mention that (at least the early releases) talked about 4k being an "upgrade" without any mention of price. That upgrade seems kind of important in this discussion, so that may be worth waiting to find out about as well.

    In any case, it certainly looks like it could be an exciting product so far, but I am reserving judgement. It would be interesting to go back to Sony camcorders after not using them since the Digital8 days.

    Edit: I did not ignore PVJames, I just started typing before his post went up. :)

  • This sounds great, and will be a great tool. Out of my price range unfortunately, but in a year or two who knows. It's really good seeing this kind of technology making it's way to consumers.