LOL...I just stumbled accross this thread for the first time and read like the first 6 pages before calling it quits. What is funny is how people take @GravitateMediaGroup's comments serioulsy. The internet can be a funny place sometimes where we just keep getting lost in translation. If there was a "facetious" button or "sarcastic' button for him to use then I think folks would have not been so offended early on. But nevertheless it made some comical reading...especially since he wouldn't back down...lol. At the end of the day I get his point. He was never disagreeing with what anyone here was saying. Nowadays many folks do think of themselves as "photographers" and have convinced uninformed people to shell out their money to pay them for their...um...(un)professional work. It's just like any other craft....like filmaking and the plethera of so-called "filmakers" or "DPs" in various forums. The tools are so cheap nowadays that anyone can place that title next to their name (and they do). Still...there are those who have been doing their crafts professionally for decades who end up quitting or writing blogs full of rants because the (amateur) competition is getting in their way. It happens. Just adapt and move on. Me personally...before I was a rocket scientist (I hate that terminology) I once made a living as an audio engineer (part time). In the 90's you could find studios to work in NYC or anywhere in the upper east coast. But it was also during that time major studios started closing down some well know spots and you started to see a great deal of home studios emerge. All of a sudden everyone became an audio engineer. Suger Honey Iced Tea happens.

@Ian_T thanks for the resume.

I believe there are several layers of reality, where there are levels of experience and learning. Just like baby's and old man's, as in photography or any other art, only when you hit the wall and realized that even if you dedicate 4 lifetimes in doing the same you would never get to that point where you'd be completely satisfied with the results. Then and only then you start to become mature in what you do.

So does raw or what ever you want and whats next to be invented does people better on what they do, well if your reality is yes, you are not mature enough, keep taking pictures and the illusion and dreams of the child will eventually become less and less important. All is down to what you have to say to others, paid or non paid job. Technology or not, Photography like painting and writing or any mean of expression is just an excuse to don't explode internally and share those things you cant by regular means. And make a living it that road.

And its just simple, the work speaks for itself you like a picture,that's a good one for you, that's it. Even if the photographer used a camera or not, who cares. Did you received a message, great. Try to transmit that message by yourself.

Its a real waste of time trying to find sense where there isn't none, and talking about how good a carpenter or pseudo carpenter would or not be if he has a wood or metal hammer. Common wake up and see the furniture.

Is like staring at the wise mans finger while is pointing to the universe.

;-)

Clearly its obvious and we both agree that if this new hammer lets you tell the story you want with half the effort at half the time, welcome new hammer :-)

That's not even into question, but sometimes to achieve specific results or to resolve problems (it's what we all do most) you need to get to that old used hammer sometimes, and the good thing is you know how to do it.

That's why some people are a technicians and others are creatives, some are both and some other don't know what they are. But competition is good, as you say more people with the tools more ideas more creativity, more inspiration you grow and get more active.

At the end as i mentioned in my last post, "And its just simple, the work speaks for itself you like a picture,that's a good one for you, that's it. Even if the photographer used a camera or not, who cares. Did you received a message, great. Try to transmit the message by yourself."

Cheers @Ian_T

I think at the opposite end of the spectrum from what Ira Glass said are those type of people who absolutely can not view their work objectively because it is something they have created themselves.

"Imagine that, you know, you built a table," said Daniel Mochon, a Tulane University marketing professor, who has studied the phenomenon. "Maybe it came out a little bit crooked. Probably your wife or your neighbor would see it for what it is, you know? A shoddy piece of workmanship. But to you that table might seem really great, because you're the one who created it. It's the fruit of your labor. And that is really the idea behind the Ikea Effect."

The Ikea Effect on NPR

@Ian_T

at the end of the day, explosive news regarding RAW video (bmcpocket, 4k raw for $4k, all the Canon ML stuff) takes the internet by storm and it makes this topic somewhat even more true/realistic. It's not that RAW makes ones skills, it's just the flexibility it offers. A director may not know anything about lightning, but if he knows he has RAW to his advantage he may not care so much about lightning and possibly an additional expense. Anybody that knows anything about cameras/filmmaking would surely agree that the more flexibility a camera has the better, correct? A $3k Canon MK3's stock just went up because a group of people gave an already great camera RAW video flexibility, on top of MULTIPLE other options that have already been available.

I really didn't want to post on this topic but I do respect that you see where I'm coming from and see the bigger picture. Most people just skipped around the topic and assumed that I get on my knees and pray to RAW every night.

+1 @leonbeas @GMC you are still so wrong. You don't think like a professional at all, your thinking is point and shoot. You don't get it and never will.

That director of yours who doesn't know and care about lighting will pay someone (me) a fortune in post to grade/relight the footage until it looks cinematic, right? This is what all that RAW flexibility bought him after all. Umm no. He doesn't know or care for better. He will go as far as finding a press-this-button plugin from Magic Bullet.

As @leonbeas says it best, "you have to practice and feel the pain of being bad at what you do, until you get to that point where flexibility helps you". For me that was buying a used DVX100 in 2009 and another one in 2011! and shooting documentary for broadcast. Did it feel like a straightjacket with 6 stops of DR? Sure did. Did I produce subpar footage? Sure did. Am I a better shooter with 10+ stops of dynamic range BECAUSE of that? You bet.

Do I think about repositioning the subject or lighting his face in daylight now? Oh noes, but the fidgety Mk3 RAW has 14 stops of DR now, you could shoot against the light, it's so easy and flexible! It only takes a couple of power windows/shapes and tracking in your grading app!

Rant over. You're hopeless because you're a random guy with a magic bullet/point and shoot mentality.

@seeker interesting point, just a better mouse trap. As I was laboriously developing in Lightroom pics I took over Easter of my nephews, my sister goes "Ah so your camera doesn't take normal pictures like ours", with a somewhat quizzical look (like in "try in two sentences or don't bother"). So I'm like "As I'm pushing these sliders around imagine I'm in a dark room pouring chemicals and shaking trays just the right amount. Your camera does that for you when you take the picture, but badly".

She understood the analogy, and will never be interested in learning "pouring chemicals and shaking trays", she wants the red button with whatever comes out. GMC's fallacy is there will be an "iAuto" button/workflow for RAW that will be sooo good and knowledgeable, that any production disaster (I bet he doesn't think in terms of "production") can be turned into watchable work. Yes RAW gives us flexibility in post (and a chance to save material that might have been unusable otherwise), but people like my sister and GMC don't want post.

@GMC, if I'm wrong about you, I extend my apology and invite you to register tomorrow at this free Scratch webinar discussing Cinealta F5/F55/F65 RAW workflows: http://www2.assimilateinc.com/e/5312/nealta-event-registration-html/tfmwj/762379155

Most people just skipped around the topic and assumed that I get on my knees and pray to RAW every night.

Actually I assumed that after looking at your website ;-)

Raw(not an acronym) doesn't give you better lighting, just more dynamic range.

A bad shot, properly exposed with poor lighting is still a bad shot with poor lighting.

Raw(not an acronym) doesn't give you better lighting, just more dynamic range.

Btw, it could be that you will be able to sculpt light via software. Adding 3D depth map and appropriate hardware can allow to make some light adjustments in post.

@cde

technology may dramatically change, it's increasing at a faster rate everyday. In 10 years we may shoot video with our eyeballs.

haha, here we go again...