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2K BlackMagic Pocket Cinema Camera, active m43, $995
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  • @_gl

    Yes on testing.


    2.5K and 5D3. It depends on how you shoot, the 5D3 will definitely appear to have more latitude in a lowlight situation, or where a frame is dominated by shadows because it's bottom heavy.

    In a broad daylight situation, contrasty, etc. the 2.5k is definitely several stops better up top.

    The Pocket Camera, in RAW, is pretty much the same image/DR, but actually seems to be a bit better in lowlight/underexposed situations than the 2.5K. I haven't done this side-by-side yet, just from memory.

    Many tests to do.

    That said, I think the 5D3 has enough range, and it depends on how you want to shoot, color preferences, etc. I find that Blackmagic cameras (when filtered properly, and sometimes even when contaminated with IR haha) have an image that lines up with my preferences.

  • @kholi --- thanks for that --- I could be 19th in a queue for the Pocket Camera ....

  • @kholi Is there any more room for Pocket Raw beta testers?? :)

  • @austinchimp Looks good... I like the grade you used.

  • Here's the colour moire I'm talking about (scaled to 200%). It's also noticeable in the fountain. Would like to see someone try in Resolve to see if BM process around it. (note I messed with them in PS raw, but the moire is there either way).

    Otherwise it's a nice image.

    1284 x 466 - 415K
  • @austinchimp I agree with Tron. Looks really good.

  • @_gl moire reduction on capture one work pretty well with this

  • Shot with both BM cams today. Footage looks great. But... I HATE shooting with them. The LCD is for the most part useless in daylight. The glare is awful. Only when combined with some sort of outboard monitor system (LCD, EVF, etc.) can you shoot with these cams outdoors during the day and not lose your mind. After sunset it wasn't as bad. I'm sure at night and indoors it's quite nice, but the focus peaking feature is absolutely necessary on these cams.

    Like any camera, there are things to love, and things to hate, and nearly always a workaround.... But there's no cheap solution to these problems. Be prepared to spend a grand on the cam, and another 2 grand or so on everything you'll want to make it a serviceable option and not be tearing your hair out. I would recommend an EVF, and/or an IKAN, SMALL HD or TVLOGIC monitor with false color, and plenty of batteries.

    Thanks to @vicharris for bringing his cams out to play. Shooting what we shot today with the GH2 would have been a nightmare, the extra DR saved our entire day.

  • @kholi Since you've mentioned IR a few times I'm curious about your opinion regarding the tiffen WW non IR ND's, the indie set for digital video?

  • We used the whole Tiffen IRND set today except the 2.1 and 1.8. So far they all look pretty damn good to me.

  • I'm curious about the non-IR set. Kholi seems to have suggested the IR ones sometimes have an undesirable effect.

  • I'm noticing a density difference between the two cams, I thought maybe it was the NDs but it's pretty consistent, and we were trading out lenses and NDs back and forth all day. And we did notice that difference in DR on the WFM when we plugged them into the IKAN and started bouncing back and forth. I wonder if that's because of the calibration. It's definitely not as wide on the pocket vs the BMCC - still nice, though. I'm guessing the pocket is close to 12 by the WFM. We'll have to do some chart tests.

    Can't help but wonder if it's the footage that's so nice, or the the fact the we had some really beautiful subjects today... both animate and inanimate, eh Vic?. :)

  • @spacewig

    I was the one that suggested Tiffen WW IR NDs before the AbelCine test thing came around. It was because I often used them on other cameras aside from the Epic, for that camera I use Schneider Platinums.

    That was for the 2.5K in the beginning, and also before I even noticed that the camera had a bit of trouble with IR.

    The Able test seemed to back up the Tiffen WW IR choice, but recently I've noticed that my 1.2 WW is kind of sketchy, and my 1.8 is generally perfect. I did a test between the .9, 1.2, and 1.8 (did not have a 1.5) and the .9 had some issues as well.

    Just tested Schneider Platinum 4x5's on the Pocket Camera and they don't seem to be the perfect solution either, but were more consistent up to 1.8. I also like that they didn't have an exaggerated green cast like the Tiffen IRs. Basically more neutral.

    I'm still trying to organize a test on the Pocket and 2.5K (both RAW) to find out what's the most solid solution. But, it's hard to coordinate a human and all of the IR options, because I want to include some of the IR only filters (Hoya, Heliopan, T1 -- don't like this one though, etc.) in combination with the Schneider, Tiffen, and Genus Vari-NDs.

    Lastly, I can't remember where I read/heard this, but it may also be a certain amount of IR's needed for a given exposure range.

    Sorry for the long reply, here are some stills (Shot Pocket Cam RAW and Kowa Anamorphics, can't share the DNGs though as it's from an early build) that show the Schneider Platinum .9 and a .9 ND grad stacked together to form a sort of variable ND in the mattebox (slide the grad down when needing more ND.) You can see that a few of the black shirts on the skaters are polluted. It's easy to correct, until it begins to pollute skin.

    That's what you do not want.

    1920 x 1080 - 743K
    1920 x 1080 - 811K
    1920 x 1080 - 777K
    1920 x 1080 - 1003K
  • I remember where I got the idea of certain amounts per stop: the T1 apparently isn't supposed to be used with more than an 0.9 ND, which suggests that it isn't strong enough beyond that point. I witnessed this during an a Blackmagic even that we held earlier this year, using the T1 on one camera because we couldn't source enough filters for the six to eight cameras that were being used.

    The camera with the T1 on it also had a 1.5 ND, and every frame on that camera was toast. xD

  • Looking from some "lab" irnd testing – can´t recall who did it but it was the same bloke who reviewed the new true NDs, It seems that you can´t be brand loyal if you want the most closely matched set. (unless using a hot mirror instead, or the true NDs - with the drawbacks they bring).

  • @RRRR

    Was it Matthew Allard?

    I've heard of TrueNDs but have never seen a set before, or actually a test. I just took a glance, it looks like they are IR filters as well... they look really good, but I would like to see them on a camera that's more susceptible to IR.

    An earlier F35 or of course, the 2.5K Blackmagic. Hmm.

  • @tron @stylz Thanks for overlooking my dodgy camera work guys. The camera is definitely a handful to use when trying to work with minimal kit and docu style. When using solely the on camera screen, focus, exposure, and white balance are all leaps of faith to some degree.

    However when got the footage back and started to grade it, wow. Instantly filmic. There is definitely a high end look that you can get from this camera that you can't get from anything else in this price range, bar magic lantern raw.

    As a side note, I learned that 32gig sandisk extreme 45mb/s cards don't cut it. Lots of dropped frames with any significant movement of the camera.

  • @kholi No it was Art Adams.. found the link, here:

    Should be interesting to try out the trueND´s on the blackmagic cams, for sure!

  • imho worth mentioning: two 4x5.65 TrueND filters will cost more than your BMDPCC..

  • I have a 77mm UV/IR behind a 77mm vari ND and so far haven't noticed much in the way of pollution. Had the 77mm for my fs700 and tried it out on a whim with the BMPC.

  • Are there any news about LPT cage in price & availability?

  • @peaceonearth

    They are pretty expensive, but that's something you carry with you to another camera. I'm wondering if the company has any plans to put the glass into 77mm filters. They could sell them at 75-80% the current MSRP and make more money.

  • @shian what lenses were you using?

  • I don't have the experience that many of you guys have, and I am working with a competent, but young crew. Saying that we are used to shooting with Canons (my DP) and Panasonics (G6 currently) and will have roughly two weeks with the pocket cinema camera before we start shooting, should we just stick with what we know for now?

  • @Mckinise imho you should go for an intense test so that you can judge by yourself where the hooks are and whether it fits to your workflow in shooting and postpro. Anyway keep your stuff in spare.