@zincoontrin It doesn't mean entirely that shadow details get discarded at longer GOPs, in fact quality of frame is not the main reason for using GOP1. The main reason is to do with how it renders motion, motion has a different look at GOP1 (or lower GOPs in general). To put simply an I-frame contains the whole frame compressed, rather than changes since, or onto, the next I-frame Which P and B frames do. Which is why B and P frames can be smaller, they need less information. This does mean however that the lower the GOP setting the higher the bitrate you're going to need, as in the case of GOP1 your compressing and storing the entire frame every frame. If, and its quite an if, running at GOP12 you can get really good I-Frame size, and B & P frames that are large enough to maintain the quality then there should be no difference between it in terms of image quality and a GOP1 stream (maintaining the bit rate is what the AQ settings are for). However, yes, the vbr codec is going to discard shadow details first (even at GOP1).
Running a very high bitrate GOP1 kind of guarantees that your bitrate isn't going to drop substantially, meaning that your shadow detail is going to be as good as (if not better) than a comparable long GOP setting. This doesn't mean though that a longer GOP lower bitrate setting couldn't, or wouldn't have given you exactly the same image quality, and level of shadow detail. It does mean the motion in the scene however would look very different, more 'filmic' as people say here, which is understandable because the stream contains whole, singularly frames.
Edit : I've not seen anyone say that GOP1 gives better shadow detail, its wrong, the extraordinarily high bitrate probably is.
@driftwood I tried your GOP1 220M settings and it's really looking great, but as I'm transcoding every footage to ProRes via 5DtoRGB I got some problems with those settings. Did you have further contact to @rarevision regarding the GOP1 files?
@driftwood "... I think you missed what I was getting at - I'm showing others what this setting actually captures in the dark!"
I get it. That's exactly what I was talking about "what it captures in the dark without smearing detail." When I said you went "extreme: I was talking about your GOP1. But, regardles of what it captures in the dark when you lift it there will be "some" noise. That's why I mentioned Neat video.
@Ian_T Yeah I read your thread and know about Neat for cleaning up noise... I think you missed what I was getting at - I'm showing others what this setting actually captures in the dark!
Thought I'd show you how much room the GOP1 220M setting gives you in the shadows. Here's the original shot at ISO 800. Here is the same grab lifted in levels photoshop. See how much more information is in there! This was grabbed from chair spin movement.
Original - Driftwood GOP1 Extreme Setting - 220M 1080p24 - shot in darkness with a single 800W Redhead on the 7-14 Wide angle - VLC screengrab.png
1261 x 633 - 600K
Out of the darkness - Driftwood GOP1 Extreme Setting - 220M 1080p24 - shot in darkness with a single 800W Redhead on the 7-14 Wide angle - VLC screengrab.png
@driftwood "You mean total safety on pappas and trees? "
Yes
"Video Buffers appear fine. From high detail, I think its maxing out on other areas, thats why I need to look at harnassing the frames a bit - downwards! "
Thanks. There's no doubt 220M GOP1 is real nice, but I'm hoping for something of this quality but at a lower bitrate. I guess I'm asking at what point is good enough and a subjective visual difference.
Video Buffers appear fine. From high detail, I think its maxing out on other areas, thats why I need to look at harnassing the frames a bit - downwards!
@Driftwood Using 24H GOP1, what is the least bitrate you can set before it fails from maximizing the buffers? Sorry if you're already posted this info.
yes, it must be downloaded. Vimeo obviously had trouble converting it to their specs. Also, Clip-Wrapping it (just a rewrap) caused a reordering of the frames. very strange. I need to try a convert to AIC, hopefully that will go better, as my 5dtorgb is not working at all for any clips.
@Vincent_Pereira I-Frames are still compressed frames, so I guess it's because the quantizer controls the compression ratio it will also control the I-frame size, buffer usage etc.