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GH2 and the BMD HyperDeck Shuttle Record Problems
  • questechquestech

    Hello All :-)

    I have a BMD HyperDeck Shuttle 2 and it records uncompressed and in the DNxHD (220) codec.

    I can import, play and edit the files just fine, but there's a major problem that makes the files useless.

    Static scenes are fine except they are flat and require color correction to make them aesthetically acceptable.

    The main problem is that the files have horrible interlacing problems... and I'll explain.

    First of all, it doesn't matter whether I shoot in FSH, HBR, 24p or don't hit the camera record button at all and just record from the cleaned display... the same problem occurs, so it isn't a camera setting (I've spent 2 days experimenting with different cam settings as well).

    When panning I get fine interlacing lines. They are annoying and unacceptable in their own right, but it gets worst. Once encoded (as in for distribution) the problem is accentuated. Huge lines appear and and make the video look horrible... it is unusable.

    On close inspection of the files in PP CS6 I can see that the file is filled with ghost images, which I thought were a result of duplicate frames that the GH2 has served to the BMD Shuttle 2.

    I've read about certain fixes for this and a the color shift issues, but a) most sound too difficult to be used in a practical workflow and at the end of the day, they may not even work.

    So I'm here with hat in hand hoping that a discussion might yield some fruit that can help me, and others that are having the same problem or looking to use a Shuttle with their GH2s.

    Update...

    I said that extra frames were being added, well I read that recording from the GH2's HDMI port added and deleted frames randomly, and that clouded my judgment and made me lean in that direction, but upon closer inspection (I was going to experiment with manually removing the extra frames) I found that there are no extra frames per-say.

    The ghosting I described is at the heart of the problem.

    When panning each frame appears to be a combination of 2 frames at different times. So depending on the speed of the pan (and the shutter speed - the higher the SS the closer together is the dual images) you get an interlaced image (half of the lines) at one point in time, and another (the other half of the lines) at a later point in time.

    Where they overlap, the image is solid, but on either side you have a "ghost" image which when played back you can see through the image where the missing lines are, thereby giving a notched edge effect.

    And I haven't even wrapped my head around how I can fix that yet??

    Thanks for your interest and feedback!!

    Anthony

  • 12 Replies sorted by
  • nomadnomad

    As long as you are shooting NTSC it is a complex issue, the GH2 is delivering a non-standard 3:2 pulldown cadence which needs a complicated fix in post. I think it's not worth the hazzle if you compare the quality of the external recording (still 8 bit and 4:2:0) to the best settings from the hack.

    If you switch to PAL, the problem is gone…

  • questechquestech

    Hi :)

    PAL isn't an option :-(

    I agree that the difference in quality between the stock AVCHD codec and even the uncompressed isn't that awe inspiring, but it does make the noise look better (less smudgy blobs that AVCHD produces and more like film grain) and because AVCHD encoded files seem to use some form of NR, that obscures the fine detail in your subject (fine line details, etc).

    I am determined to make this work, so I need a fix.

    Thanks for the input, I appreciate it!!

  • MeierhansMeierhans

    Note that serious gamma issues - even with cam recording - have been reported in conjuction with HDMI capture.

  • Ralph_BRalph_B

    @questech

    This is nothing new. It's been like this since day one of the GH2. The only true fix involves the use of Avisynth.

  • Ralph_BRalph_B

    @Meierhans

    Please stop spreading FUD. There are no "serious gamma issues". It's well known that one should never record HDMI when the GH2 is in standby. When the camera is recording internally, the HDMI picture has a slightly different color rendering (I'm not even sure 'gamma' is the right word to describe it), and frankly, it looks BETTER than the in-camera version - it pops more, without losing any detail in the highlights or shadows.

  • nomadnomad

    Same here, if you are recording in camera, the HDMI output is pretty close, no massive gamma issues at all.

  • questechquestech

    Thanks Guys!

    I looked at that solution and it looked rather involved, but after all of the experimentation and reading I've been doing, I think I'm going to take a closer look at it!

    Could we all get together and sign a virtual petition to get Panasonic to do a little firmware work that addresses the HDMI out issue??

    From my experience it's clear that they don't listen to individuals, but maybe they wouldn't be able to ignore a mass!

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    Could we all get together and sign a virtual petition to get Panasonic to do a little firmware work that addresses the HDMI out issue??

    Petitions never work :-)

    Plus, most probably, it is pure hardware issue.

  • nomadnomad

    If you consider that workflow too involved, why not shoot 25p and slow it down to 24p?

    We can only hope that the GH3 might cure it, but petitions are futile…

  • questechquestech

    Hey Guys

    Vitaliy_Kiselev - I get the hardware issue thing.

    nomad - I never thought of shooting 25p but I also don't remember any settings that allowed the GH2 the option of shooting at 25p?? How do you do that?

    I was also of the understanding that it doesn't matter what mode you shoot in, the HDMI spits out 1080i 60 regardless of your internal record mode??

    As far as petitions... I've helped win elections, get a street lined with no parking signs, helped change ethics laws in NYS, boycotted companies for unfair practices, and more for years.

    I'm not a political liberal, but I was discussing the destruction of the rain forest with a group of pharmaceutical reps (I'm also a corporate trainer) and I was making the point that it only takes one person to start a movement that can snowball into real change. A skeptical woman in the group said to me "What can one man do to stop the raping of the rain forest?" and I reminded her that it only took one man to start the destruction in the first place, and that worked out to be quite effective :-)

  • questechquestech

    I believe I found a solution, and it doesn't require any additional software or complicated workflow!!

    I'll post my results soon... AM

  • nomadnomad

    Sure, I don't think all petitions are futile, I'm a Greenpeace supporter. But as Vitaliy said, I believe they don't work for this subject.

    Regarding 25p: switch the GH2 to PAL (after the hack you can do it to any GH2) and record HBR 25p. The HDMI output will deliver PsF with 25 full frames, record with the Ninja and just tell your NLE to treat it as progressive. Bingo!

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