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25p official topic, aka Don't cry for me Argentina
  • 236 Replies sorted by
  • Donnie88Donnie88
    In Final Cut Pro, you know how to do it?

    If this is possible, then I may go for that method; Shoot 720/50p > Frame skip so it's 25p > Export 1080/25p.
  • bdegaziobdegazio
    @Donnie88 - Just create a 25fps timeline and drop your 50 fps footage on it. FCPX automatically plays it back at 25 fps.
  • Donnie88Donnie88
    Fantastic, that's all sorted for me. I'll export the 720/25p in 1080/25p then.

    Sounds like problem solved until they bring out native 1080/25p.
  • rogerpillyrogerpilly
    Actually, why not shooting 720/25p, as it's now possible with PTool 3.61d? Unless you need to slomo, my understanding is that you get less compression vs. shooting 50p. Anyone can confirm?
    And also, another method would be to shoot at 1080/24p, conform to 25, edit and then slow it down to 96% using Twixtor, as stated in one of their tutorials. I have done a short test (rendering takes forever on my 4 and a half year old Macbook Pro) but I didn't notice any artifact. Any thoughts?

    By the way, thank you very much Vitally, wonderful work! Very much appreciated!
  • PixCanFlyPixCanFly
    With a higher bitrate hack, I think it's a viable option to shoot 720/50p and edit on a 25fps time. Upscale 720 to 1080 is not a problem. Previously, the unhack GH2 720/50p (17mbps) is just too low.

    Btw, what's the most stable and gorgeous looking 720/50p setting for hacked GH2 at the moment?
  • Donnie88Donnie88
    @rogerpilly That would be even better if you get less compression with the PTool 720/25p. Why would you not get slow-mo with this?

    @PixCanFly If the PTool 720/25p is good, then there may not be a need to do the 720/50>720/25p>1080/25p method.
  • ButtButt
    @PixCanFly
    my settings for 720/50p
    setc.zip
    421B
  • andresandres
    sad, sad, sad.
    I think I will pass on the gh2 (happy with my gh1, it just works).
    perhaps gh3 will bring 1080 50p and global shutter.
  • rogerpillyrogerpilly
    @Donnie88

    "Why would you not get slow-mo with this?"

    You could, but you'd have to duplicate frames or use a plug in like Twixtor or other forms of artifacts. While there is an opportunity with DSLR to shoot natively at 60 fps, then conform it with Cinema Tools at 24 or 25. When you play it back it is natively slowed down by 2.5 (at 24, slightly less at 25). In this case you get beautiful slomo, as good as when originated on film by overcranking the camera.
  • alcomposeralcomposer
    @andres

    honestly- get a GH2 - by the time the GH3 is hacked into shape (taking into account that Panny will not be sending VK a SDK) you will probably we wanting to get the GH4... Vicious cycle... Nip it in the bud...

    720p50 is great for news etc, and when it gets higher bit rate it will scream - remember the GH2 is doing pixel binning not frame skipping- so as far as I am aware - all the lovely data is being used!

    (someone correct me if I am wrong)
  • Mark_the_HarpMark_the_Harp
    There has been talk in the low GOP thread about a high bitrate / low GOP setting for 1080i which I'm going to try now my computer is back in action. In terms of detail at least, none of the high-bitrate 720p footage I've seen has been as good as even the stock 24p (IMO) so I'm keen to see what you can get out of 1080i 50. For me the interest is twofold: I'm in a PAL region, and I have 2 HD camcorders to use alongside my GH2.
  • stevespielburgerstevespielburger
    Hi guys, been reading this with great interest. I did a test just then with my GH2 in 24p mode and one of my other cams shooting 25p,
    put them both on the kitchen bench, and shot for 30min,
    every few min i got in shot and clapped hands and stuff,
    lighting was halogen (PAL land).
    I then dropped them into Premiere Pro in a 25p sequence,
    synced the first few seconds, then went to end expecting to have to drag the 24p into sync with the rate stretch tool.
    Didnt have to, the whole thing was perfectly in sync from start to finish, I could see any dramas with the lighting, strobing and such ( which I did get in the US recently when shooting at night with my GH1 at 25p 25 shutter).
    There was no frame blending that I could see.
    So, if you dont need the audio from the 24p cam, are there any issues that would arise in a multi cam shoot where one cam is 24p and the others 25p?
    any thoughts greatly appreciated.
  • Mark_the_HarpMark_the_Harp
    @stevespielburger if there wasn't much motion in shot you probably wouldn't notice artifacts from changing 24 to 25
  • sam_sticklandsam_stickland
    @madact Sure, I didn't mean to imply that 25p isn't needed.

    From my perspective, I'm still shooting 25p on an old DVX100B, but I'm seriously considering getting a GH2. Since my work isn't for broadcast (more of an expensive hobby), I just figured I'd shoot 24p on the GH2 if 25p isn't available or as nice looking.

    I was trying to get a handle of how much of a problem the light flickering effect would be. It seems with the right choice of shutter speed it's not really an issue (since people have always been dealing with this on 24p regardless of region).
  • CobyDCobyD
    I just hacked my NTSC GH2 to enable PAL<->NTSC switching, and enabled the 25P option for 720 AVCHD. It does indeed produce genuine 720P25.

    I have not played with bitrates as yet, and there are no B-frames, so I can't comment on the quality. But eyeballing it, it looked OK.
  • MimirsanMimirsan
    @Sam
    Light flicker isnt a problem with 24p as long as you shoot with correct shutter speed.
    30fps can be a issue but not 24p ;-)
  • Donnie88Donnie88
    What's the most filmic shutter speed for the GH2? With my HPX171 I always used 180.0
  • MimirsanMimirsan
    probably roughly double the framerate
    ie
    24/25p 50 shutter
    30p 60 shutter
    50/60 120 shutter (but I still use 50 shutter)
    Theres the usual shutter rules...but rules are made to be broken lol
  • Donnie88Donnie88
    So I'll be going for 50 shutter then, as I intend to shoot 24p (or hopefully 25p)!
  • GrunfGrunf
    What about modifying 1080p24 time base so it reads faster?

    There is a variable somewhere that tells camera how fast to read the chip etc. Is it possible to "hunt it down" and change it? I guess it's a rate at which some crystal clock is divided or such.
  • ogelecekogelecek
    I have just bought a GH1 from amazon. The day i got it last week, i hacked it. That week, I filmed some speedy videos to make sure the 50p --> slow motion option is working (BTW I live in a PAL country.) Check out the video and tell me what you think:



    I was happy about the results...

    What i have done is, i have put the 50fps 1280x720 AVCHD files into Sony Vegas 10. Changed the composition settings to 1280x720 / Field order : progressive scan/ Frame Rate: Double Pal (50 fps)...

    When I opened the files on Timeline, i right clicked on the files, changed the Properties from SMART RESEMBLE --> DISABLE RESEMBLE

    Then I slowed down the speed .. I rendered it as the same settings, only changed the frame rate to Normal PAL this time(25 fps)..
  • exhardyexhardy
    @ogelecek
    you should do all these things in a 25p timeline, and you will get a lot smoother video
  • RamboRambo
    @exhardy: are you saying it will then blend rather than drop frames??
  • CobyDCobyD
    I've had a couple of questions about the 50P->25P option that I mentioned in my earlier post, so to clarify:

    1) The unhacked PAL GH2 has a 720p50 AVCHD option, and the unhacked NTSC GH2 has a 720p60 AVCHD option.

    2) The PTool361d hack enables a PAL<->NTSC menu item that lets you switch back and forwards between these two framerates (be sure to reformat your SD card after each switch).

    3) PTool361d also has another two additional checkboxes that allow you to replace 720p50 with 720p25, and replace 720p60 with 720p30. You can select either one, or both, of these options when you apply the hack. So, for example, I have my GH2 presently set to 720P60 when in NTSC mode, and 720p25 when in PAL mode.

    Hope that explains things a little better.
  • flyguyflyguy
    cobyD> After i apply the hack to enabled 720p25p, it still get 720p50p? How do you change the settings on the camera to get 720p25p? Thanks.
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