Coronavirus: Proper protection

Vitaliy_Kiselev

Below are results of my own research and reading lot of stuff. It is not medical advice.

Probability to catch virus:

Via touching something with your hands and later touching face - really low, but it is best to not tocuh face and wash everything
Via eyes - also low, but if you are in normal situation, not inside hospital! Note that virus can't travel via blood or such.
Inhaling, via lungs - very high, around 99,8% of people got it such way

Protection measures:

Cloth masks, DiY masks - better than nothing, but really bad, this is that all firms start doing now after destruction of manufacturing outside China
Surgical masks - much much better, can be useful for time of low number of sick people, ignore goverments that it is needed for sick people only
N95 masks - really overvalued for normal people, as they are exepsive now and it is too easy to get small amount of virus while you are removing it
N95 masks with gel padding - much better, bit still not ideal due to filters, some have changable filters and will be much cheaper in long term, check the size
Respirators (half masks) with N95 filters (aka prefilters) - Better than any mask, but N95 filters are not perfect
Respirators (half masks) with P3 aka N99/N100 filters (HEPA filters) - Best option, closed filters, easy to store, impossible to catch virus via inhaling if mask fits
Full face masks with P3 aka N99/N100 filters (HEPA filters) - best option if you want full warranty as it protect your eyes

Reusing N95 and surgical one time masks

Having old mask is around 100x better than having none.

Just put each mask carefully in big transparent packet, close it by turning slowly. Either just put pocket in any place for 3 days, or put outside to the hot sun. Do not do such things if you work in hospital and want to reuse mask each day - is such case you need proper sterilization.

Goverment and WHO recommendations

Fully ignore them, as their main goal is to not cause panic and protect goverment clerks.

So they'll keep telling you that you can go without mask until they can.

Specific things

Look for 3M full face and half mask and their Chinese copies. Can use other masks, but make sure you have connector to attach 3M compatible filters.

Best half mask is 3M 7500 series mask. Internal part is made from silicone. Chinese copies are considered ok.

https://aliexpress.com/item/32860574480.html

Size is really important for 7500 series it is 7501, 7502 and 7503. Below are size charts:

For filters - you need 3M 6035 P3 filter, better to get 5-10 pairs, as stock will be totally vanishing soon. Such filters are not available online in CHina last time.

Can even use expensive P100 filters if no other options - https://aliexpress.com/item/32893281313.html

Try not to use open P3 filters (look like flat disks usually).

If you absolutely can't find P3 filters use 5N11 prefilters with any other chemical filter.

https://aliexpress.com/item/4000780068891.html

Most popular full face mask is 3M 6800, chinese copies are worse, but usable for our task.

https://aliexpress.com/item/33017122131.html

MikeLinn

MikeLinn

Vitaliy_Kiselev

Filters inside (P3 HEPA filter inside)

MikeLinn

kurth

@Vitaliy....I had to wear my n95 gel lined for an hour and a half at the bank. It's very hot. I'd prefer to stay home ! A full mars mask would give me claustrophobia. I'll go live in the mountains before I'll become accustomed to this crap ! And per your "how you catch the virus....remember that dr david price er doctor video where he said the exact opposite....that most people were getting it by touching . And I remember reading about wuhan doctors saying the eyes were a big contagion point. So we can only assume we can catch it just about every way there is.

Vitaliy_Kiselev

@kurth

My present understanding is that constant push for eyes part and touching are intentional.

First, this virus in regard of distribution and survival is NOT original and same as all his peers. Despite media claims.
Second, my understanding is that virus can't get into your blood and go into other areas (!) and your eyes can get tiny amount of it only with nowhere for it to expand. Virus needs air movement and huge space he gets inside lungs.
Third, lot of this claims constantly do not mention specifics and real proof. It can be that lot of medical personell constantly contacted heavy ill patients and inhaled virus (due to issues with mask) while telling how they properly weared the mask or respirator. And it is recorded in statistics as touch distribution. Also medics in such places can't and shouldn't be compared to usual people (as they are exposed to 1000x more virus particles and for 1000x longer time).
Forth. As far as I checked all claims about virus touch distribution - it is based on samples collection and using PCR. Thing is that it is incorrect method, as fact of RNA part being present do not make this virus calable of doing anything, it can be part of totally dead thing and does not mean that it is enough of this viruses.

My own understanding is that public media do not push all this narrative randomly. As it allows to break normal logic of offering to block distribution using proper masks. It also allow to guide people attention to non important places and not become responsible for lack of masks and proper state storage of such things.

Look at other topic - http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/23743/coronavirus-taiwan-korea-and-japan-paradox#Item_3 and look at the strange media behaviour. As only thing in common among this countries and China is... strict discipline and wearing masks. Shitty simple cheap masks (efficiency will be around 100x if they move to best solutions). While their economies did not stopped so much and people are nicely walking in the parks (in EU all of them are locked and protected!).

It is big data on fighting flu and older coronaviruses and it shows quite good efficiency of Aisan approach.

jleo

jleo

[VK Edit]

Chart attached below seems to have no proof.

kurth

@jleo....I don't understand how a surgical mask , which isn't form-fitting to the face, would protect the same as an n95. Doesn't make sense. When I lightly blow with my mask on, I feel no current escaping. That can't be true with a surgical mask, even when they have some type of strip to bend to the shape of the nose. When someone is inhaling a percentage of air will be drawn in around the edge. Here's an article on the different types of n95. Valved performed better.... https://www.quora.com/Is-an-N95-mask-with-a-valve-on-it-better-than-one-without ...the person that invents an efficient, light, comfortable and reusable mask at a reasonable price will get rich. Maybe 3d custom printing with ?...oops, someone's already there... https://copper3d.com/hackthepandemic/

Vitaliy_Kiselev

@kurth

Actually, original post have link to reusable mask that is cheap (yet slightly small, for smaller faces or womans)

https://aliexpress.com/item/4000780665632.html

All this "3d printed" masks are total crap as you need good seal and this is only possible with injection made rubber or silicone.

@jleo graphics is clearly VERY misleading and looks like something juts put arbitrary numbers.

kurth

@Vitaly....how about how they make hollywood prop masks, where a mold is taken of your face, and only a filter ring is inserted. This could allow a smaller mask that only covers the mouth and nostrils. Or maybe just a tiny nostril mask and breath exclusively thru the nose while using ? Life can't return to any sense of normalcy with everyone dressing up to go scuba diving.

Vitaliy_Kiselev

@kurth

For now most advanced thing that can be applied in real life for real people is few sizes of silicon seal.

kurth

ny telling frontline medical staff they will have to work w/o ppe.... https://www.nydailynews.com/coronavirus/ny-coronavirus-protective-equipment-ppe-hospitals-memo-20200403-yfziltd3bfewjkptunzsf7cmee-story.html .... I'd quit, but maybe they'll be laid off first.... can I use "unbelievable" too often ? ....https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/03/us/politics/coronavirus-health-care-workers-layoffs.html

kurth

the future.... https://nasofilters.com/n95-mask/ and these were on amazon and disappeared.... bearhoho https://www.krobeysm.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=754402 ... and from china, although not n95, they're probably on the way.... https://www.aliexpress.com/i/32812157356.html .... and maybe a piece of duct tape , huh?

Vitaliy_Kiselev

@kurth

I made separate topic at http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/23749/coronavirus-masks-and-respirators-discussion

Vitaliy_Kiselev

Different standards

Vitaliy_Kiselev

Good article on filtration

https://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/409903O/respiratory-protection-against-biohazards.pdf

Simple masks efficiency

Vitaliy_Kiselev

mee

The masks VK is posting are indeed the best route. Honeywell makes very good ones with very soft silicone for about $40USD with replacement cartridges about $2 - $4 for a set of two. Cheaper than n95 in the long run, and if you put it on right you will know, as you will feel the suction and hear the pressure release on exhaling. Sorta like Darth Vader. The thing that makes these so good beyond typically better filtration is putting the cartridges away from your mouth means they stay dry and don't act as incubators for viruses. The good ones have a sorta diaphram (dual on some) that allows your breath to come out instead of going back out through the filters. Just be aware when you wear it long enough it will drip from the diaphram, so if you are in public, a hanky or something to wipe your drips would be considerate, and obviously safer for others around you if you were sick. Honestly good respirators are more comfortable than N95 as they do not slip around. It is probably worth mentioning if you ride a bike or do similar activity you want to slow down as it is hard to get as much air, and at the very least it will make you winded easier and give you a headache. Worst case, you pass out.

Vitaliy_Kiselev

@mee

For bike it is best to use 3M 6500QL series, as you can instantly lower it, and as you get off you can get it on back in a second.

Vitaliy_Kiselev

On masks/respirators fitting

Instead of making hrrrid tracking apps, both Apple and Google needed to make 3D face scan app so oyu could get perfect mask/respirator in nearest goverment center (or shipped to you at home).

Such apps are not hard (as they exist, as well as algos) and 3d scan can be done using usual front camera (but you need to turn you had slowly).

alcomposer

Yup, could even be 3D printed, with generic rubber gasket attachment.

robertGL

For my job, I have a 3m face-shield mask, and give it 8/10 stars. It is pretty comfortable and can make a good seal. Facial hair can undo the seal pretty easily though, but that shouldn't be a big deal with covid; it's more a hazard from noxious gas or microfine dust

kurth

@robertGL...why would you think a beard wouldn't be a big deal destroying the seal of your mask with coronavirus ? You're seriously wrong.

robertGL

That's because a higher rated respirator are the tyvek hood types with forced or supplied air that cost a whole lot more. My job has those also and facial hair are not a problem. Again, they are higher level/cost

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