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'Apocalypse Now' Experimental Series 1 Thread - BOOM, Intravenus - cbrandin/driftwood AN Soft/Cinema
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  • @driftwood my initial tests of AN Boom Flat looks very good. No lock ups with rec or playback using SanDisk Extreme 30MB/s 32GB cards. Image looks very flat and skin tones look great, grades well in AE and AMC, nice fine grain at iso's up to 1000. The highlights seem to roll off very well with the picture profile set to smooth -2 all round and banding is much smoother than any other patches I have tried and it has good detail in the shadows with much less macro blocking. 24h mode cadence is smooth. The MTS files now have a more constant bit rate @ 142 mbps. I'm not concerned about card space or spanning for my broadcast work, it's more about getting the best I can out of this little beast. This patch makes my Canon lenses look even more creamier - which is what I like, and works well with m43 lenses. Thanks for all your tireless efforts.

    00081.MTS_snapshot_00.04_[2012.09.07_01.32.bmp
    1920 x 1080 - 8M
    00081.MTS_snapshot_00.04_[2012.09.07_01.33.png
    1920 x 1080 - 4M
  • @Mirrorkisser I also noticed. Possibly, although adjustment may be necessity slightly, I am already going to look at the result possibly more for the time being. This is a new starting point. :-)

  • I really can't decide which I like more... :(

    SO THANKS GUYS! :)))))

  • @bkmcwd: the footage looks really nice. But in the lower left on the electricity lines there seem to be some artifacts...maybe my eye is fooling me, i dont know.

  • @CBrandin PNG supports mathmatically (not just visually) lossless compression, but Vegas also supports TIFF output (and I seem to remember BMP) and VirtualDub supports BMP output as well. When I export PNGs from VirtualDub, they have been mathmatically lossless in the past. I will be happy to do an inversion test again vs the BMP output to see if that holds true in the current version.

    But PNG (except when used at lower color depths, like 256 colors) is setup for mathmatically lossless compression, not visually lossless. So any discrepancies would be caused by a mismatch between the encoder and decoders support of the format.

    I use PNG as opposed to BMP because the file sizes are smaller and the format is more widely supported in browsers for inline viewing. But I also pretty exclusively use it in 8-bit so I get lossless results. The compression ratios/quality dialogs for some programs can be confusing on that point but think of it the same way you do ZIP file compression: more compression means smaller files and longer to decompress, but it does not mean a loss of data.

    I completely agree with you about JPEG, though. That is why I usually post PNG.

  • The sample of "Valkyrie 444 TYPE-ZERO1" with Pany lense. Please DL original MTS file to look the REAL IQ from vimeo.

    Pany 14-42mm F8.0 1/50 ISO320 NOS.(-2,+1,0,-2)

    Valkyrie_444_TYPE-ZERO1_Sunset.jpg
    1297 x 634 - 256K
  • @Tobsen

    Thanks for using Valkyrie and comment! :-)

    "How does this one compare to Valkyrie soft? Softer? Sharper?"

    I think that 444 TYPE-ZERO1 is "Softer" than Valkyrie 444 soft.

    And "Warning" is just directed at "444 TYPE-ZERO1" testers.

    "444 Soft matrix" is 444 matrix modified by Nick.

    Probably, it will be better not to use 444 TYPE-ZERO1, if you mainly use 25p. If it is 444 Soft, also in 25p, I think that it is satisfactory.

  • @bkmcwd I used your settings "Valkyrie soft" for an interview on Tuesday. It was shot in HBR and ACCIDENTLY 50i on the second cam. Despite the wrong interlaced setting, the footage turned out nicely. I really like skintones!

    This morning I saw that you released another version called TYPEZERO1. How does this one compare to Valkyrie soft? Softer? Sharper? Or something else?

    I also read the following:

    "Warning! : in this setting, all the modes of AVCHD other than 24p are experimental. Please keep in mind that artifacts often appears in HBR, 1080i and 720p in spite of being very stable. These will be improved from now on."

    SInce I am interested in mainly 25p, are the HBR/50i settings of Valkyrie soft also experimental and may lead to artifacts? Or is this warning just directed at TYPEZERO1 testers?

    In our footage I didn't see any artifacts so far. I and was planning on keeping it in my cam for a an upcoming corporate shoot and hope it is not experimental. Don't want to find out in post later...

    Thanks again for the great settings!

  • I agree that screenshots aren't ideal because there is the issue of adjustments made to accommodate the display colorspace, etc... , even if screenshots are uncompressed. However, PNG or JPG files are even worse because the image has been recompressed. It's impossible to separate artifacts caused by H.264 and artifacts caused by the recompression. Vegas, for example can export as JPG or PNG, and the two don't look exactly the same. What is needed is an uncompressed format - like BMP.

  • @Mrhechang

    Thanks for good looking sample footage, mate! Can the beauty of image quality be recognized also in YouTube? :-)

  • Regarding spanning.

    As I have said many times before, the card that has the highest chance of spanning is the SanDisk 95MBs 64GB. Many testers use this to test new settings and it has demonstrated higher performance than any other card tested with the GH2 (as of a few months ago).

    If you are using that card, the overwhelming majority of settings will span in 24H. If a given setting does not, it is very notable and important to say so.

    There are other settings (both by @Driftwood and others like @LPowell and @Ralph_B) that place a higher priority on spanning and will span on a much wider variety of cards.

    The Transcend cards are among the least likely to span with high bitrate performance settings. The Delkin Elite 633x and the SanDisk Extreme cards rated at 30 or 45MBs will be able run a wider range. But the SanDisk 95MBs 64GB version will span with more settings than any other card tested to date. It is THE card to get for GH2 hacked settings at the moment.

    If you want to see one of the areas where these settings differ more, you can use controlled (and repeatable) lighting and position to create banding in your favorite old setting and then shoot it with one of the new matrices. The differences range from subtle to noticeable depending on the material and may be very important for some people.

    In regards to earlier comments about the diffrent settings and the difference in the way they looked vs the way that different cameras looked, I would offer my personal paradigm on the topic.

    Every scene has a certain potential range. No matter what camera or lens you bring in, all possible results will fall within that potential range. If you leave the lighting as is, and the scene is static, then the next variables are the lens and position from which the scene is shot.

    Once those parameters are locked off, "specific potential" for the shot is determined by the combination of lens and camera. No codec can exceed the specific potential of the shot, only try to live up to it. On a conceptual level, most people feel that a codec is doing a good job when it appears (to them) to get close to what they originally perceived or what they wanted to perceive. Since the original subject is infinite in detail and the the codec produces a finite approximation, something will always get lost.

    With higher bitrates, the potential for a codec to have enough data available to record a more accurate approximation of the subject increases. The more difficult the detail is to render in a small number of bytes, the more important the number of available byetes (or the compression approach) becomes.

    To perform a meaningful comparison of the limits of different codec settings, the shot must exhibit visual deficincies in at least one of the tested settings. If you are testing new settings, start with a scene - macroblocking, banding, jaggies or other undesirables - in your old settings. To get a better sense ofline, shoot as a JPEG at 1920x1080 (or whatever resolution is equivalent to your video mode) and RAW.

    That provides a baseline with which to compare the settings and a good indicator of whether the scene is sufficiently demanding to illustrate the differences with the naked eye.

    @cbrandin @lpowell I would skip using screenshots and just export specific frames as PNGs. This is easy to do with minimal processing in apps like VirtualDub for 8-bit files.

  • Apocalypse Now "Nebula 444 Soft" from Abraham Aponte on Vimeo.

    Check out the link of sample footage of Nebula 444 Soft. this was done with no color grading at all, the settings i chose are described in the video enjoy this awesome patch. Idk how to embed the video to the forum correctly for you guys to see it from here any advice on how would be great!

  • @jakepowell yes, but tomorrow now I'm tired!

  • @rajamalik, test out the settings for yourself.

  • @Lambo nice boom test , can we see an ungraded version?

  • @driftwood which setting is better for panny lenses 12-35 x and 14-140 g.

  • @petersoncinema Cool vid, I might go do that some time!

  • @petersoncinema Nice video! Which AN?

    @Driftwood Just a couple of observations. AN Drewnet soft does seem to handle problem colors better (red & green especially). It looks better to me in low light than CM Night. So far, it's handling 720p OK which is a must for me. It handles motion well.

    All these are more important to me than who's image of a 200% rivet shows the impact divot more clearly.

    One interesting thing which is neither good or bad, just different. The first thing I do when I import into AE is check the WB. Color Finesse recommends a cheat by just hitting auto color to WB then go in and adjust the image. This works 90% of the time but not in AN. The WB is off and the colors are deeply saturated.

    The only reason I mention this is that it works for all the settings I've tried except AN, so there is definitely something different with it.

    Overall...I love it!

  • @petersoncinema The video looks good. Any issue with noise at all?

    Is it me or do the images from these new patches make the GH2 look like Sony camera footage? Not saying it as a bad thing...just....something about it.

  • Valkyrie 444 TYPE-ZERO1 'Apocalypse Now' with cbrandin 'Pure Original 444 Matrix' by bkmcwd
    Film Mode:Nos -2,-2,0,0 (AWB:B+5)


    LUMIX G X VARIO 12-35mm F2.8
    LUMIX G 20mm F1.7
    LEICA DG MACRO ELMARIT 45mm F2.8
    Contax Plannar 50mm F1.4
    Contax Sonnar 85mm F2.8
    CANON New FD 50mm F1.4
    CANON New FD 35mm F2
    Asahi Pentax Super Takumar 55mm F1.8

  • Interesting in terms of spanning results on an Extreme 45 mB/s 32 gig card:

    AN GOP 6, 24L- could not span, maximum overall bit rate of fairly still footage of 50.4 mb/s

    AN 'IntraVenus' Settings - Intra GOP1, 24L - spanned fine on 2 different scenes, maximum overall bit rate of 75.4 mb/s

    Could be due to the higher GOP?

    Very new to all of this.

    Loved the quality of these patches- man, the noise is so much more controlled than other patches I've tried!

  • Hey guys, I went camping over the weekend and made a little video using the Apocalypse Now hack. So far I really like it, let me know what you think.

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