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CINEMA Picture Style
  • Maybe some of you know this, but it's new for me. It's for Canon as usually, of course. But that's what should make GH-series much more mighty - the picture characteristics hack, not higher and higher bitrates and GOPs... My idea is to pay really big attention and work about that matter of GH which I am sure will be the most important and essential revolution in GH hacking at all!!!

    http://www.cineplus.ch/cinema.html

  • 25 Replies sorted by
  • We already have numerious discussion about it. It is not new idea, and big time had been spend on it already.

  • Spent on discussion or on hacking?

  • This and a clean HDMI out would be the 2 biggest things that would change everything in the GH2 world. The GH2 would finally be unleashed. Give Vitaliy and Chris a little more time.

  • Yes, Brian202020, absolutely right!

    I'm not urgent, but the obsession about reaching useless highest bitrates and deepest details is slowing down the 2 biggest things you mention. Vitaliy, Chris, LPowell and others gave us many important options with their work, but I think that they are becoming a slaves of endless tests of those bitrates and few other parameters which will never give the "magic" of the cinematic picture.

    There are a lot of discussions showing many advantages of GH-series over Canon DSLRs, but Canon DSLRs still keep higher prices, why??? - Generally because of the patches made for them like Techicolor Cinestyle, CINEMA Picture Style and etc. which concern the PICTURE characterization!

  • I do love the driftwood hack and other high bitrate hacks. BUT I think we are getting to a point of diminishing returns in terms of bitrate. Colors/range/gradability is something I would love to see implemented. Technicolor CineStyle-esque flatness would be a great thing to make the GH2 even better.

    What is the current state of these kinds of hacks/patches? I know theres lots of discussion, but is there a definitive answer on how close anyone is to getting flatter profiles?

  • @JPB1138

    I see no point going into circles. We are working on it. But it is not an easy task.

  • Well we appreciate the work! Thanks. It's probably hard satiating so many peoples wants and needs.

  • A flat look for GH2 is really what many pro users want for GH2. Especially to recover some of the highlights that are often pruned off.

    "Smooth" mode is probably my favorite film mode but I have noticed that some specific green hues are not properly captured using this profile. The disatisfying thing about GH2 picture styles is that none of them are perfect, you have to pick the less bad of them. Cinema mode brings strange yellowish highlights and darker shadows. (it is a failure to me) Technicolor Cinestyle is really the best flat picture style for DSLR. (but I prefer GH2 sharpness from far) Cineplus style is not a flat, it is very contrasty, it may be filmic but it's "already baked" style (at the opposite of the flat philosophy). Cheers

    Respect to Vitaliy ! Can't wait to have the new 1.1 firmware hacked !

  • Good lord. Talk about self-entitled.

    Why don't you actually search the posts before making suggestions that you somehow think you alone have been brillant enough to come up with?

    They are hacking binary code. You're making a wishlist with no concept of how difficult it is. What's being worked on is what CAN be worked on.

    You're just not going to get most of this stuff. Ever. It's been looked over. There's no magic key that's going to appear and "unleash the camera" any more than it already is. Just refinements.

  • For real. I wish we could get an organized donation going, with a specific goal. I'm sure people have donated... but for the extreme amount of time and effort something like this requires, It'd be nice if we could figure out the kind of resources required for VK to have others help him on it etc. I would be very willing to donate again if we have an organized goal in mind. I'm sure it doesn't all come down to money... but I bet it sure helps.

  • @L1N3ARX

    It'll never happen. Same is for cameras (except body collections).

    We already had long discussions about it, and as I said, research of how styles and other images parameters work is one of the top priorities.

  • @producer, I reckon you have to spend every lunchtime going through the posts on personalview to work this stuff out. There are gems in here.

    I've now done 42 mini-projects with the GH2 and I'm no where near the quality of the stuff that's in the showcase.

    A good friend of mine has given me two 40 min session on colour grading and I've worked through Davinci tutorials, yet the colour grading I see here still eludes me (colour ninjas please post more ;) )

    Take a look at the GH2 verus Arri stuff to see how close the GH2 can get. Mr Driftwood is using different patches for different situations.

    I'm going to post on sound shortly as I've been testing a prototype muff for the GH2.

  • @andyharris

    Many of us are are now using colorghear with adobe afterfx. You might want to check out the thread. Its a collection of presets done by a colorist aimed at the GH2. His tutorials are very good.

  • I agree, with pre crushed baked in color, adding higher bit rate doesn't really add much to the final result. But when and if a log profile is available (Maybe Panasonic would give us one in the GH-3, would cost them nothing but some code). We will see how the GH-x high bitrate/GOP1 beats the others. Other than RAW or 10,12,16 bit codecs

  • @Vitaliy_Kiselev, well thanks for hanging in there. I wish people / non-programmers could visualize how unbelievably difficult something like this is. If they only knew, no one would ever dare ask in such an entitled way... or throw out impatient requests for "custom picture profiles".

  • @L1N3ARX: Please, read carefully one more time my entire thread. Do you really read about "impatient requests for "custom picture profiles"? All I posted is just my suggestion compared to Canon patches which help selling of their DSLRs too much. So, I just shared my point that such a patches and improvements are much considerable and important. And if you and some other people doesn't think it's important, just don't take advantage of such a hack someday when VK and the other mighty persons create it.

  • @producer, VK responded to a separate post saying this has long been discussed and that it is being worked on. I as well, have witnessed this topic come up many times, to which my post referred. I wasn't actually talking to you guy :-)

  • When it does come, whether that's with the GH3 or the hack community progress, I think the most important thing will be understanding how the film modes have been affecting noise reduction and sharpening together, not so much contrast etc.

    With the limitations of 8-bit and everything happening so far up the chain, a flatter profile (this is just my guess) will just add more complications to the equation versus alleviating them. However, my eyes pick up these two parameters and how they affect the final video image.

    Knowing what the absolute zero really is for noise reduction, and the absolute zero for sharpening is will tell us a lot about the camera's true image; well, maybe. Maybe not.

  • Of course we don't realized how difficult it is, some people are "end users" here ! We don't even have a clue. We are not within the Matrix... I'm pretty sure all members have a huge respect toward the hack development and wat is being done.

    Some ideas that are talked about are "wishes" not even "requests". I was talking about what "Panasonic" offers in terms of picture styles compared to "Canon". (comparing the 2 companies) As concerns topics that as arealdy been discussed, I guess anyone can understand that if you are following 3 or 4 forums from time to time you can't follow through all the topics. So please be kind (and forgiving) :) Sharing views between colorist, cinematographers, vfx operators and programers is great.

  • +1 @ghostlayer

    Just remember guys, that while this forum has many components to it, the hack has drawn many to it who basically expect it to be a done deal when, as we all know, it is not. This beta testing will continue because that's what the testers do and, from one who is not a tester, I applaud them. I've been visiting here for many months and still haven't hacked because I don't need to. Yet. I'm new to the digital way. The gh2 is my first digital camera. FCPX is my first NLE. And now I'm learning Logic because I need to. For me it's one step at a time.

    My "old" 2009 27"imac. core2duo has a hard enough time with what I'm throwing at it now. 170mbps will put the poor dear out to pasture. I upgraded the ram to 12 but the lack of 12 cores is obvious. Storage space is also a concern but, for me in digital diapers, it is not the issue. Not being able to rely on my camera is. Any problems I have with getting the shot I want... my glossy imac screen will show me who to talk to. I don't want to test. Just do.

    There's a lot of great stuff on this site that has nothing to do with the hack. Be encouraged to check it all out and hit the FAQ at the top of the page when required and search the topics on the right side.

  • GH3 released already, but still there is not any patch which tends even a little bit to such a flat picture style in GH2, although this was discussed for long time. Obviously it's not only difficult, it seems to be impossible. Or maybe the too many released patches for higher bitrate and quality - most of them similar to each other - eat the time that should be spent for at least one type of flat style for GH series. Hope such a patch will be released before GH5 appears...

  • @producer

    I don't really think that the new patches take up that much or any of @Vitaliy_Kiselev 's time.

    I'm also not sure that @driftwood or @lpowell have the means to even begin working on the picture style settings.

    So I don't understand why you keep implying that the patches are the reason why we haven't seen a flatter picture style.

  • I think if you want the advantages of a truly flat picture, look to BMCC.

  • giving a gh2 hdmi clean out is possible? hmmmm