Driftwood Cluster X Series 4:│Moon T8│Spizz T7

x_worpig_x

@driftwood If you made an Intra variation, would you still have a constant bit rate of 80Mbps? Or would it be much higher?

brudney

@driftwood thank you and great news! any chance of 6gop nebula variation of IV3?

brudney

@x_worpig_x Driftwood already said it would be around 280Mbps - that's crazy high ;)

T1000

@driftwood

Some questions about Moon T8 and Drewnet 10:

Aside from the bitrates what are the differences between Drewnet 10 and Moon T8 then? Does one grade better than the other? Would the Moon variation of Drewnet 10 look and grade better than Drewnet 10?

Thanks for all your continued work on these hacks!

TATZU

@driftwood how can i keep the bit-rate from dropping as low as 70mbps or less on 24h moont8 i would like to keep it around 140+

rojg

First time poster..

Tried Spizz t7 with sandisk 95mb 64gig card on FSH, looks great, no spanning though.. more tests when time permits.

driftwood

Driftwood ClassiX - with Intravenus v3 matrix (4,4,4,127s)

80Mbs 24p (12 GOP classic) Constant with a 4,4,4,127 hi/low frequency matrix - nice 'fine' filmic grain in the dark! Uses a lot of processing power but keeps a constant 80Mbps (quantiser changes automatically to meet picture requirement)

50p/60p (6 GOP) 50-60Mbps Variable

HBR/1080i/25p/50i - 40Mbps PAL (12 GOP),

HBR/1080i30/60i - (3 GOP) 60Mbps avg NTSC

Very high quality matrix rendering artefacts out.

Notes:

Use Low modes for spanning.

24pH will give you 7mins10 secs avg recordings per 3.99Gb.

BEST EVER LONG GOP 24P? BEST EVER 720P / HBR MODES with hi quality fine grain matrices.

TRY IT AND REPORT BACK. THANKS

Intra Freaks: If you want to try out the 24p matrices found inside 'ClassiX' on the old All-I Intravenus v2 - open & edit Intravenus 2 and copy over the scaling tables from this setting into it. Enjoy.

matt_gh2

@driftwood Timing on release of Moon T8 and ClassiX w IV3 is perfect - I've got project Im shooting in a few weeks, so I'm squaring away look now. If I edit IV2 to add scaling tables from ClassiX setting, will it span (or would test be necessary)? Thanks!

DarkwinQuark

Driftwood, so great you're back!
I've tried the ClassiX hack and shot in a mostly dark environment (concert hall) with an auto-focus controlled lens (will try a manual focus lens in the next days).
For me, spanning worked in 1080p 24H (SanDisk 64 gig), but I got my camera to crash once when I was shooting 24H in Ex. Conv. Tele mode (I did a side-pan right before the camera crashed and almost exclusively had non-lit audience members in front of me). Can't play that file now. But I was shooting a lot in the Ex. Tele mode and that was the only time it would crash.
But the hack looks great! Haven't tried much grading. Will get into that later.

producer

I tested Moon T8 in different situations and what I notice in every test is a presence of a lot of deep smoothness. It's like a Neat Video pre-applied with high settings, even when GH2's NR is set to -2.

See the frames before and after (raw and graded) below. Anyone with similar observations?

cjdincer

@producer yep! you're right, I guess your deep smoothness is what @driftwood says "a finer low frequency matrix that strives to knock out artefacting at the expense of QP and higher bitrates." finer looking shadows and out of focus backgrounds. Also colour change seems less than T7 when you hit record or is it me?

producer

@cjdincer: Oh, the colors are not only less, they are drastically changed after pressing the record button. That time the whole picture becomes blown out, blue and red almost disappear and only greyish/greenish remains, no matter what WB was set in advance. Also, about the out of focus backgrounds: they seem to be lost of details when focusing on them more than the previous patches I've tested. Again: I'm talking about indoor situations.

Richard_Blood

I'm using Sandisk Extreme Pro, 95MB/s 16gb. All modes work except 720 60fps SH and variable movie mode in 720 when using <<<80%. I get the "recording was cancelled due to the writing speed limitations of card". Which is odd because the 1080 files have much more avg bit rate and don't fail.

gittzy

Bug Test:

Standard of tests: ALL NTSC video modes (VBR, HBR, FH, FSH, 24p, 24H, etc) for at least 5 minutes continuously. Racking Aperture and lighting conditions, zoom and movement. Brand New 64gb 95mb/s Extreme Pro card purchased from B&H delivered yesterday. Year old Sandisk Extreme 64gb 45mb/s microSD card with San disk included adapter.

Results:

SanDisk Extreme® microSDHC™/microSDXC™ UHS-I Card 45mb/s MICROSD Moon T8:
No stops within 5 minutes test of each mode. In camera playback functional, clips loaded into premier, audio Working working fine.

ClassiX Intravenus v3 matrix: No stops within 5 minutes test of each mode. In camera playback functional, clips loaded into premier, audio working.

SanDisk Extreme Pro® SDXC™ UHS-I Memory Card 95mb/s SD Moon T8: not yet fully tested yet.

ClassiX Intravenus v3 matrix: VBR 80%: Film stopped instantly when introduced to complex subjects, high contrast lighting, zooming an and out rapidly, panning or dollying. HBR and 1080i modes: Intermittently stopped filming within 1-3 minutes twice in 5 attempts, couldn’t pin down what caused it. No in camera playback, No audio in VBR 80% clips when loaded on the computer.

next test: complete T8 tests on 95mb/s card to see if there are any additional errors.

Spanning test.

Basis of these findings: While waiting for the 95mb/s SD card that I ordered from B&H, I began testing T8 with my micro SD card and didn’t encounter any of the problems members have been addressing this week. The 95 card arrived yesterday and the Micro SD card behaved surprisingly better than the new 95mb/s card did (though I haven’t performed a spanning test in all modes on either yet, I want to narrow down what’s specifically problematic first.) Why would a 45mb/s MICRO SD in an adapter card record more reliably than a 95mb/s SD card?

Empirical observation: Micro SD card was not nearly as hot after filming tests

Additional Tests: will control test temperature with a a laser thermometer after identical footage and check differences.

Thanks everyone, Have FUN!

marciocons

@gittzy Is the card a Sandisk? What is the problem with the card? Is it original?

gittzy

Both cards are SanDisk brand 64GB cards @marciocons, under similar stress tests the MICRO SD Extreme 64GB 45mb/s in its card adapter performed flawlessly under all the same conditions. The new 64GB Extreme PRO 95mbps card stopped recording in VBR <<<%80 modes, and HBR 1080i, and had audio rendering, playback, and import problems. These experiments surprised me, because I would have expected more stable performance out of the newer, faster full size SD card, when instead the Micro SD 64GB worked flawlessly in all the same tests. I did my best to force it to crash or stop. I'm testing spanning now on both cards in Moon T8, then I will test Spizz, as well as Classix and report back differences on the cards and performances. Hope I don't raise more questions than I can answer and that this ads a positive variable to stabilize these amazing new GOPs.

driftwood

gittzy; You dont get audio in 80%mode.

Anyone like the HBR & 720p modes?

Azo

@gittzy

Maybe you have a defective 95mbps card. Try benchmarking the card on your computer you should get around 70mbs.

zachasurp

Shot some quick tests with Moon T8 1080p 24H, had no problems, and had playback. 32GB Sandisk Extreme.

I will say though... Shot my GH4 alongside in 4K and 1080, and man did the GH2 look great... Almost better in fact. I think having sharpness turned down to -5 on GH4 is too much, and I know this is a little off topic, but GH2 Moon T8 looks phenomenal! Will have to redo my tests to be sure, but everything worked amazingly the first time.

Huge thanks to all involved.

jhonnyskulls

Classix looks awesome, Intravenus V3 fine matrix its really really nice. The only problem is that i cant playback in camera, I have a 95mb/s 32GB sandisk.

DarkwinQuark

@jhonnyskulls Not even after turning the camera off and restarting it? WIth the classix hack I couldn't play back ANY file directly. Had to restart the camera every time, but then playback worked

marciocons

@jhonnnysulls and @jhonnyskulls , try to install the patch with the AUDIO options disabled in Ptools. I was having this king of issue with both Moon T8 and Drewnet T9, however after proceeding as mentioned, playback is working fine.

jhonnyskulls

I can play the files after restarting the camera.

gittzy

Yes, @driftwood, no audio during playback in cam or computer at the %80 VBR (no other audio problems with any other setting). I managed to test spanning Moon T8 and ClassiX and had interesting results with these two cards (temperatures and run times) I'll post later. Further more, @AZO, I will benchmark the 95mb/s card and report back. Thanks everyone! Everything I'm recording looks incredible

gittzy

I'm not getting benchmarks at 70mbps @Azo. I'm getting 38mbps, but that seems consistent with http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/1491/95mbs-sandisk-extreme-pro-cards/p6, Running OSX, with built in SD card reader. Does anyone recommend a gold standard for testing on a mac's local SD card reader?

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