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The IKONOSKOP RAW 16 mm Camera
  • hardahmedhardahmed
    Has anyone come across this camera....Cost about 7000 Euros but records in raw sequences and CinemaDNG format (12-bit). This is the first time i have seen this camera. Don't know if its good or not..Any opinions...???

    http://www.ikonoskop.com/dii/
  • 28 Replies sorted by
  • brianlucebrianluce
    It's been rumored for a long time. It got to Scarlet like levels of frustration from interested buyers. But I hear it finally is shipping? It's basically a couple of Scandanavian guys producing it, but they seem to know what they're doing. Hope the footage is good.
  • hardahmedhardahmed
    Yeah very different looking cine camera for sure..with a LCD at the side of it for the director to view.... see this link for the pics from NAB 2011... its at the bottom....Many camera manufacturers are trying to make it look different from standard camera designs since RED introduced their cameras....

    http://provideocoalition.com/index.php/awilt/story/nab_2011_-_cameras/
  • MarkVMarkV
    woha.. this is really cool! I need to look into that!
  • GOODEMPIREGOODEMPIRE
    hm. interesting.
  • endotoxicendotoxic
    Ikonoskop makes remakable manufacturing in their cinema film cameras. I know they use a CCD sensor, from kodak. No rolling shutter, no alising, or strange compression artifacts we are used to see. I feel they have not manage to clearly distribute their products, due to problems in their own manufacturing process for digital stuff.

    But this both Scandanavian guys for shure know what they are doing.

    Personaly i think is the best option for its size, and type of sensor. i see no competition for its price point and its robustnes.

  • BuellerBueller
    Maybe you guys have already seen this footage but I thought I would just repost it in case you have not. I think that they have gotten quite a bit right with this camera and I am sure that if it takes off that memory size and cost will adjust. In my opinion it does has a good "organic" feel to it. It's not going to be perfect for some people, but overall a very good set of choices were made.

    http://www.ikonoskop.com/dii/footage/
  • brianlucebrianluce
    It's always seemed like a great product. If I were a billionaire I'd give them seed money. I'd have them rename it the "brianCam".
    Footage looks great.
  • No_SuRReNDeRNo_SuRReNDeR
    I really like the fact its a CCD....CMOS "jello/jelly" is seriously driving me nuts and sure its not 4k---but still that's a selling point if you ask me.
  • No_SuRReNDeRNo_SuRReNDeR
    --Specs-- in case you are too lazy to leave the forum....

    Image size -- 1920 x 1080 pixels
    Format -- Individual files in RAW sequences. CinemaDNG format
    Colour depth -- 12 bit
    File size -- 3,5 MB/frame in RAW
    Sensor -- CCD: 10,6 mm x 6 mm (16 mm size)
    Framerate -- 1 - 30 fps
    Sound -- 2 channel line in 16 bit, 48 kHz via Lemo to XLR
    Timecode -- 5 pol. Lemo SMTPE
    Viewfinder -- VGA LCD viewfinder and OLED side display*
    Video out -- HD-SDI
    Data output -- USB 2.0
    Power -- 7,2 V in, or onboard Sony NP-F770
    Body -- Milled aluminum
    Measures -- 222 mm x 91,5 mm x 83 mm
    Lensmount -- PL, Leica M, IMS and C-mount
    Threads -- 3/8" and 1/4"
    Weight -- Less than 1,5 kg incl. memory cartridge and battery
  • EOSHDEOSHD
    Nice interview and concept. Shame the sensor is so small.
  • No_SuRReNDeRNo_SuRReNDeR
    Well it is 12bit color with HD-SdI out and a CCD sensor so it would be great for broadcast HD documentary stuff I would imagine. The real "revolutionary" part is the fact that it shoots uncompressed not RAW....Uncompressed. :(... but I dont think they can make CCD's as big as CMOS becuase of heat issues I believe- IDK not a sensor expert.

    I think the KineRaw is a better future prospect if it ever comes out...
    http://www.kineraw.com/kineraw_s16_1.html ---see other thread...
  • stefanosstefanos
    a few thoughts on the Ikonoskop...

    Nice sensor (even though there are better kodak 2/3 sensors out there) , very nice sensor size, raw , CCD, etc but..

    -you must realise that the media management is proprietary (no off the shelf ssd or hdd) so a complete system with media is significantly more expensive than what they advertise (hidden costs etc).
    -also, it is pretty much an ergonomic nightmare.
    - for those who don't know much about ikonoskop history, their site strategy, what happened with their forum especially was an embarassing mess. And ofcourse, their whole pre-order strategy was quite low of them and sneaky, but not uncommon for low-volume camera companies.
    -also, I'm not a big fan of the decision of their decision to use adobe DNG format. A proprietary format that isn't future proof and kind of dangerous if you ask me.

    there are loads of good points ofcourse , and I would trade any sub 10,000 camera for it, but we must wait to see when they will deliver and for what price.
  • Ian_TIan_T
    This camera's been out for the last few years I thought?
  • stefanosstefanos
    @Ian_T
    LOL:)
  • brianlucebrianluce
    @Ian_T
    The camera was initially promised for release in early 1988, just prior to the fall of the Berlin Wall.
    No. Seriously, I think this one is worth the wait. 2/3rds sensor is still pretty big. In the pre dslr era we'd die for that. @Stefanos: I too am skeptical of the form fact, though the inventor touts it as a selling point. The interviewer didn't look too comfortable scrunching his neck up, perhaps he thought it was shoulder mount? It's what, head mount?

  • No_SuRReNDeRNo_SuRReNDeR
    Well obviously camera choice comes down to user needs. Maybe you shoot allot in foreign countries and need a small package for high quality HD video for a TV broadcast or your in indie who does documentaries in dangerous place where you need to be able to shoot jerky Omg there's a bomb going off 100 yards away! (journalism stuff)...

    If you need the features here I think its a good buy for price certainly there are other options out there that are just as good or better but I personally sway more on the "cinematic" side of the fence so I'm really not interested in it to be honest.
  • LPowellLPowell
    @brianluce - "It's what, head mount?"

    Definitely, and the Ikonoskop custom head mount is a real game-changer:
    Jean-Luc-Picard-as-Locutus-of-Borg-jean-luc-picard-10587126-800-600.jpg
    800 x 600 - 203K
  • brianlucebrianluce
    @LPowell

    I think it is actually. In the video didn't he say the 3 points are your hands and head? I don't see how you can use it as a shouldermount unless you're born with no neck.

    I hope Adam Wilt gets ahold of one and puts it through its paces.


  • brianlucebrianluce
    Also, the Borg/Ikonoskop head mount is nothing to get excited about, Indisystems and the Chinese Ebayers have had similar get ups for the GH2. So calm down.
  • hardahmedhardahmed
    Nice discussion guys just in case i'll post two more links regarding the IKONOSKOP incase you havent come across, the design of the camera is great to be mounted on RC Cars or small footprints in a Film project.
    http://www.ergonomidesign.com/Default.aspx?ID=55.

    @ brianluce
    I didnt know it was known way back in 1988, since the company was founded in 1999.
    http://www.imakenews.com/ptcexpress/e_article001675872.cfm?x=bgC1HdG,b67r881t,w

    About this camera to date they have sold 140 units of this camera, its a great thing to look forward to, we should be supporting them in their development (they have a potential room for improvement) , but Im thinking how many of us would want to shoot in 16mm?. I mean how many people are shooting with 16mm these days considering its not the standard, or is it?
  • bwhitzbwhitz
    I really like the look of the footage from this... it just needs higher frame-rates. Only 30fps is just not that flexible for a RAW camera like this. You need at least 60fps over-cranking ability for music video or commercial work...
  • krjaakkrjaak
    It has 30FPS now, but it will shoot 60fps, thats what the makers say.
    here is independent forum by users to a-cam users http://iaug.freeforums.org/index.php
    here is some first footage


    Regards

    Jaak
  • brianlucebrianluce
    I think the large sensor craze may spell doom for this nice camera. Even the GH2 gets knifed for being a mere m43 size sensor. Everyone feels that bigger is better. Valid or not, that seems to be the status quo right now in filmworld.
  • astrabanastraban
    @brianluce True. In every aspects (ergonomic, portability, sensor, etc) i love this little monster ; just see a (tiny!) prob on the EVF : I wish it was just a little bit redesigned to keep the head parralel to the camera, i.e. straight on your subject.

    Here is an interesting (1 year old) interview with one of the creator







  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

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