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Editing audio with video reference
  • I'm doing a little experiment (I'll post it later) where I need to add specific effect (I presume some sort of echo, don't really know the laws of acoustics and how they translate in Audition...but I'm learning) in the specific precise part of the the timeline.

    I've finished with the video and audio edit but the audio sounds flat. It's much too even to be realistic. So what I want to do is to cue Premiere to a point in the edit where the scene ambiance changes, and then edit that part of the sound with proper sound effect for that ambiance. (I don't think I can manage it with Premiere's set of effects).

    Is there a way to do this and make the audio smooth in on the effect rather than just jump in - while I'm editing in reference to the exact part of the timeline?

  • 10 Replies sorted by
  • Not sure exactly without seeing what you're doing, and a while since I've used premiere, but if you are doing what I think you are, the easiest way of doing it, without having sync problems, is to export a copy of the entire audio for that particular section (including the bits you don't want to alter), treat the whole thing, then import the copy and then mix between the original and treated version of the audio.

    Without knowing premiere that well, and assuming you have one clip or section which contains the whole sequence including the bit somewhere in the middle where it changes, basically,

    1. export a copy of the audio from that clip or alternatively, load that clip straight into audition if it lets you
    2. modify it in audition (add reverb or whatever) but don't change the length of the clip and then
    3. put this copy back on an audio track adjacent to the "normal" audio with the clip. You may need to save it first as a different filename. Having got your treated audio back into the timeline on a track adjacent to the original audio, make sure the two are in sync (because you haven't altered the length of the new audio, they will all begin and end at the same point). Then
    4. move the start point of the modified audio (don't slide the whole thing along, otherwise you will lose sync) to the point you want the acoustic to change
    5. Unlink the video and its "normal" audio track, and end the "normal" audio shortly afterwards (you need to unlink it so the video stays the right length.
    6. then mix between the two where they overlap.

    That way you will get a smooth transition between your normal audio and the "treated" audio but it will all stay in sync and also you will clearly be able to see by looking at the timeline, where each bit of audio starts and stops. Plus, you will have flexibility as to where to start and end the "treated" audio - you can just play around with the in / out / crossfades of the normal and treated audio tracks.

    Most editors (I'm sure premiere pro does) can also do an automated mix, so you could also just keep all the tracks as they were - up to the end of point 3 above - and then mix between the normal and the treated version. Automated mixdown in a video editor is something you need to be careful with as it's easy to lose track of what you're doing and not so easy to see what's going on. I tend to use automated mixing only in the final stages of an edit, and use the technique of splitting and moving audio for specific events during an edit, like the job you're attempting.

  • In other editors, like Sony Vegas, I would split the audio at the point you want it to change, move the section after the split to an adjacent audio track, add an effect to the new track only, and then move the start point of the audio on the new track backwards a bit so it overlaps the original track, then mix between the two.

    Don't know if that helps in premiere as I haven't used it in a while, but you may be able to do something like this, which saves moving it from Premiere. However, I personally would use Audition as it's a much better audio editor.

    When doing this sort of stuff, whatever the NLE, it's better if you unlink the audio and video once you've done the initial splitting as you can then adjust the in / out points of the audio without affecting the attached video, but you must be careful not to slide it along the timeline while it's unlinked, otherwise you'll lose sync.

  • What part of that scene's audio do you want to effect changes on? Dialogue, ambiance, foley, music?

  • Would like to add realistic echo when the car gets into these narrow streets, between buildings...I tried with panning but it doesn't work that well. Sorry for the crappy quality, I rendered it 720x404...

  • @Riker Is that the real sound of the car engine or is the engine sound added? I mean are the radio and engine sounds part of the same audio file? To my ears the "too realistic" sound is the radio and whatever knocking sound comes from inside the car. It kills the effect of racing through the streets and makes you think, oh I'm just inside an ordinary car. You could do this by using a Low Pass filter (LPF) to cut out the higher frequencies since the engine sound is made up of lower frequencies. Some reverb could be added but you will need to adjust the decay time constantly to sort of match the narrow streets, turns etc.

  • i've added the v8 sound, the actual car is a something like a small Renault :D

    i didn't like the feel of the clip without incar noise...probably because I knew the engine sound was fake so I tried to distract the audience.

    Honestly, when you first saw the clip, did it occur that the sound was faked or not? I want criticism :)

  • @Riker - It's pretty hard to judge with the low quality clip. I mean, for me, it fits right now. Now if you were to upload a high res version, I would expect way more mastering.

  • I'll upload it later...I've done another test also :D

  • @Riker when it comes to sound design its not about whether things sound "real" or "fake" but if its convincing, that is, believable by the audience. With that said, good film sound is generally not appreciated, because when its good you're not supposed to notice it. The sound should fully compliment the image but not stand out. Strangely enough people tend to believe "fake" constructed sound effects more than real location sound, so that's why tv, hollywood, commercials still does it that way, even though recording technology is better and cheaper than ever.

    First time watching your clip, the engine sound was believable to me, but since you asked for a critical ear, I thought about what I noticed which was that little knocking sound, it takes my attention away from the engine, the movement of the car and the mood of those narrow streets. If you keep the original interior sound I would at least try to EQ it, lowering the high frequencies a bit, try making it mono etc.

    What will make it work is probably not what you would logically think. Visual images feed the logical part of your brain while sound works on a more emotional level. Ask yourself what is the emotional effect of these shots for the film and how can the sound support it? (Sorry if I sound too smart. I teach sound design so I have to repeat this stuff students all the time).

  • If you haven't looked into physical modelling, or convolution reverbs, I would definitely start there. It's a big topic, but basically you want your sound in a space, whether it is a street, a building, a stadium or a phone booth.