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RED Komodo - last attempt to save old developments
  • In usual manner Jarred wrote:

    • It is not DSMC3
    • It is not a replacement for DSMC2
    • It is not 8k VV
    • It is not a Dragon or a Helium or a Gemini or a Monstro Sensor
    • It does not have an HDMI port
    • It does not use proprietary media
    • It is not a “module”
    • It is not under $5k, unless you own a Hydrogen.
    • It has no XLR ports
    • It does not have a fixed lens
    • It’s body does not weight more than 2 pounds.
    • It is not larger than 4 inches in any dimension.

    image

    O.. and since Komodo is alive and breathing and you will probably see it pop up over the next few weeks and months in the hands of some very talented people banging on it to try and break it.

    Camera had been developed as partner to their smartphone, but as it tanked completely they made few changes.

    Unfortunately RED is fully uncompetitive, and can't eat Z-CAM or BM cameras shares, so here we will see another marketing stunt.

    It will be first cinema camera oriented ONLY to people who won't use it much - to rich and quite young audience, as I had been told it will be lawyers and computer developers in US.

    In other words, it is same audience Panasonic FF cameras are aimed at by Japan marketing management (as my Japanese source told).

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  • 30 Replies sorted by
  • Red set the low-end professional product road map many year's ago when the announced but never delivered 3k for $3k (Scarlet). Now they are following other's roadmaps and strategies which is sad. That said, their top of the range products produce great images, so if the can offer similar quality with a lower total cost of ownership/configuration by integrating relatively affordable media etc, it would be great to have a RED sensor based camera that could be ready to shoot for $7k-$9k.

  • Considering that $7k-$9k is the cost of four 1 TB mini-mags, I am going to guess that it will not be "ready to shoot" for that cost.

  • @tfinn

    It will require their smartphone for all advanced features, as besides it will have only record button.

    Target cost to production is around $499 and this is considering very expensive Red methods.

  • Exactly, it will require a smartphone, plus "x", and "x", and after a few more "x"'s, then it will be ready to shoot. In fairness, that's true of a lot of cameras.

    I don't begrudge Red. They have their brand and they have absolute fanatics who will pay any amount of $ for anything they do. All of this Komodo stuff seems like a distraction to the JinniMag stuff, anyway.

  • And to be clear, I think you are 100% right, Vitaly. The target market here is wealthy people who will not use often.

  • @tfinn

    The target market here is wealthy people who will not use often.

    Capitalism loves such things.

    As main purpose of camera consumer for all capitalist firms is to put camera on shelf or break it and buy new ASAP. Usage is not required unless it makes you buy new accessories.

  • image

    we are now in the external testing stage of Komodo... will be for the next few months. During prep late last week with one of our favorite teams of course an impossible request comes in which had about a 4% probability of getting done in time. Low and behold... a few dedicated rockstars from the RED engineering team worked around the clock to get it done and they just got it done. I know most of you came here for the pretty picture ... but now that I have your attention I wanted to make sure everyone knew just how great the people that make all your RED cameras are. Truly above and beyond. So yeah... I’m stealing this moment to say thank you to my team that keeps on doing the impossible... thank you and carry on.

    RED could not wait any longer, so they need at least publish marketing things to oppose two new 6K raw cameras.

    But this time it will tank completely and Jarred won't save the ship.

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  • Rigging most cameras isn’t that expensive If one has been in the game for a while. I’ve used the same rods, evf’s, baseplates on my last 4 camera bodies. The problem with red is, I don’t want their stupid phone to use their camera. And if their phone is necessary, it will be a giant flop.

  • @cls105

    It must be required, as no way they could sell the manufactured stock otherwise.

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  • Komodo Specs

    • What's Komodo? A RED Compact Utility Camera in a small Cube-Cam form factor ready to pickup and shoot. Just add batteries, lens, media, and likely a display.
    • Sensor Technology = New 6K Sensor that features Global Shutter and Rolling Shutter Modes as well as Phase Detect Auto Focus
    • Max FPS = 6K FF @ 40fps, 6K WS @50fps. We can guestimate at 5K and 4K fps, but fps might change as they refine things ever so so slightly
    • Anamorphic Support = Appears so
    • Codec Support = Internal Compressed RAW = REDCODE RAW, unknown if other codecs are supported as of now
    • Lens Mount = Integrated Canon RF Mount (easy to adapt to nearly anything)
    • Media Type = CFast 2.0 (body features a media slot compartment w/ door)
    • Power Options = Dual Slot Canon BP Style Batteries (various capacities) w/ hot swap and ability to run off one battery + DC IN (LEMO) - Lower Power Draw than DSMC2 for sure
    • Camera Control = Integrated Touch Screen, On Camera Buttons, Some sort of Smartphone Interface, WiFi Control, EXT Port
    • Monitoring = Top Side Pogo Cableless Display Tech, 4K 6G or 12G SDI Out
    • Audio = Mic In 3.5mm jack, Headphone Jack, Internal Scratch Mic
    • Camera Cooling = It appears there's an internal heat sink and fan w/ vent
    • Form Factor = < 4x4x4" and built like a tank IMO
    • Body Weight = < 2lbs
    • Body Contruction = Appears to be Magnesium/Aluminum Alloy
    • Buttons/Indicators = On/Off Switch, Power/Status Indicator, Record Button, Tally Light, Menu, Menu Selection Up/Down, Funtion Set, Playback (probably toggle), 2X Eject Buttons for Batteries, Media Compartment Open
    • Wireless Camera Inteface/Control = WiFi w/ Antenna
    • Mobile Phone Support = Android and IOS
    • Rigging = 1/4"-20 around Pogo, 4X M4 around front of camera, 1X M3 for focus hook, general base plate form factor of DSMC2-style bodies
    • Price Point = sub $5,000 USD for Hydrogen One Owners, normal MSRP is a mystery for now
    • Camera Release Date = 2020, likely on the earlier side of things
  • why would anyone buy a Red camera in 2020 is beyond me

  • How long until Black Magic announces an RF mount Pocket 6K camera for 2500?

  • @Sammy "why would anyone buy a Red camera in 2020 is beyond me"

    Global Shutter. The thing Blackmagic promised 5 years ago, delivered, and then removed from their camera.. The thing Panasonic hinted at 5 years ago (with organic 8K M4/3rd sensor), then said it was too difficult. Global Shutter is a huge advantage especially if done right. Red is alive until others implement and master Global Shutter.

  • I think the promise of GS always is elusive, but it's always been a compromise with what else you horse trade in that sensor design.

    Now, maybe Komodo has solved some of those problems. Sony went AWAY from a GS with the Venice after introducing it on their previous top tier camera.

    BMD introduced a GS camera that NEVER was that great, though some still swear by it. But it has limited DR, low ISO, and noise problems. Digital Bolex never made a Buisiness case either. They folded. AJA Cion was still born. Arri stopped making the Alexa Studio. Aaton went broke making Penelope. No one that makes GS shutters does them for long.

    So far I've found the Komodo shot's a bit underwhelming. But I also know how hard it is to work with pre-production equipment and even hard when you're in lock down.

    JB

  • @johnbrawley - I agree. I think Komodo has a kind of gray cast to the image, like it is rounding off the highlights to appear to have more dynamic range than it has.

    Here's a comparison to the Pocket 6k which tends not to have any obvious highlight rolloff or color cast to the image.

    That said, there are times when the Komodo looks nice if you want to limit the dynamic range of the image. For example, If you are shooing in direct sun light, the Komodo may be preferred.

    Speaking of GS vs RS here as screen capture from the video above, which shows the difference. Click the image to view.

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  • That test shows how impressive the pocket 6k is . Minimal rolling shutter ,about same dr if not more than red ,much cheaper

  • @sammy, check this video

    https://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/comment/277260#Comment_277260

    And you'll understand that now RED is more of lawyers company than good engineers, it is just some inertia still present.

  • Vk I know it's a scam ,they will die soon